MINUTES OF THE MEETING OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS

BREVARD COUNTY, FLORIDA

 

 

November 20, 2007

 

 

 

The Board of County Commissioners of Brevard County, Florida, met in regular session on November 20, 2007 at 9:02 a.m. in the Government Center Commission Room, Building C, 2725 Judge Fran Jamieson Way, Viera, Florida.  Present were:  Chairperson Jackie Colon,  Commissioners Truman Scarborough, Chuck Nelson, Helen Voltz, and Mary Bolin, County Manager Peggy Busacca, and County Attorney Scott Knox.

 

 

The Invocation was given by Reverend Rick McConn, Good Shepherd Wesleyan Church, Satellite Beach, Florida.

 

 

Chairperson Jackie Colon led the assembly in the Pledge of Allegiance.   

 

 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to approve the Minutes of the September 6, 2007 Regular Meeting, September 18, 2007 Special Meeting, and September 25, 2007 Regular Meeting.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to appoint Commissioner Scarborough as Chairman of the Board of County Commissioners for 2007-2008.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Commissioner Colon presented the gavel to Chairman Scarborough.

 

Motion by Commissioner Colon, seconded by Commissioner Scarborough, to appoint Commissioner Bolin as the Vice Chairman of the Board of County Commissioners for 2007-2008.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough expressed thanks to Commissioner Colon on behalf of the Board; and stated he does not think people realize what it means to be Chairman.  He stated the last meeting was from 9:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m.; it takes a special kind of person to lead such a meeting; and again expressed appreciation to Commissioner Colon. 

 

Commissioner Colon expressed appreciation to the Board for allowing her to carry on this year; stated it has been a very interesting year; and she also wants to thank staff because it was a difficult year.  She stated the Board put God first, which was important to her; the Board starts with prayer at every meeting; the Board was making decisions that were going to affect thousands of people; and it also had to let go of so many people in the County.  She stated Thanksgiving is this week; all she thinks about is making sure that the Lord protects those folks that the Board had to let go and their families; that is all she has been thinking about since the workshops took place; and no matter how tough she may act, inside she is just praying and asking the Lord to give her wisdom.  Commissioner Colon stated the Lord has been good to the County because it made it through this difficult year; other communities were at each other’s throats; she got feedback on how other communities were treating each other; it was terrible; but her fellow Commissioners made her proud.  She stated God knew what he was doing when he gave her this group of Commissioners because she would not have been able to do it without the four of them; they showed courage, professionalism, and compassion; and that was extremely important to her this year especially.  She requested the audience to help her thank the four Commissioners who stood by her in this very difficult year. 

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated there are points in life where transition occurs; and when they occur it is nice to have someone like Brigadier General Susan Helms at the helm.  He read aloud a resolution congratulating Brigadier General Susan Helms on her outstanding career.

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to adopt Resolution congratulating Brigadier General Susan Helms on her outstanding career and offering support of Space Launch Complex 40 as SpaceX’s new Falcon 9 rocket launch facilities.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Brigadier General Susan Helms stated it is her pleasure to be here today for this recognition and to thank the Board for its continued support for the 45^th Space Wing, all the men and women in uniform, and all those who support the men and women in uniform, both directly and indirectly.  She stated Commissioner Scarborough was kind enough to invite her today to receive this recognition and to talk about her experience in Russia.  She stated those who are familiar with the International Space Station Program will know that it is effectively international and a successful experiment with people working wonderfully together; but for those who were at the beginning of the program, it did not look that easy.  She stated bringing together international partners from around the world to do what is the most challenging engineering project known to man was difficult technically, but probably more difficult culturally; the reason it worked is because the people who are at the grassroots level, who knew that bringing this together was extremely important for the nation strategically, made it work; and they had the attitude that this had to work.  She stated it was like an arranged marriage with people from around the world where they could not get a divorce; and today the 45^th Space Wing has been recognized for bringing together a new kind of partner to come to the Air Force property and do a new kind of launch business.  She stated the commercial business that is seen today that is at the forefront will be a very large part of the County’s future; it is a somewhat different culture than the old Cold War mindset; and today they are looking at a commercial culture, a national security culture, and certainly a NASA culture that is part of that.  She stated it is all about an attitude of making it work; and today when she thinks about what is ahead, as long as people want to make it succeed, it will be successful; and she looks forward to leading the 45^th Space Wing to work with Space Exploration Technologies, Inc., known as SpaceX, because they are bringing a new business to the area which will have a great benefit not only for the local community but for the nation in terms of what they have to offer economically and from a point of national security if they are successful.  General Helms stated her experience with the Russians made her come to this with a view that it can work; it is all about the attitude that is brought to the plan; and she appreciates the honor of the Resolution the Board has given her.  She stated she cannot say how much it means to the members of the 45^th Space Wing to receive that kind of recognition, specifically at the start of what will be many months of hard work to make this happen.  She expressed appreciation to Chairman Scarborough. 

 

Chairman Scarborough thanked General Helms and the Air Force for their efforts in trying to rethink the whole process. 

 

The Board as a whole presented the Resolution to General Helms. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated General Helms brought the Board wonderful news, but today is to honor General Helms; and thanked General Helms on behalf of the community.  She stated General Helms is a role model for every young girl; it is incredible what she has been able to accomplish; and advised of being appointed by Senator Mel Martinez to serve on the Selection Board for the Air Force Academy.  She commented on the applicants; and stated this is the kind of information that the whole world should hear because sometimes people hear about the negative instead of how hard working young people are.  She advised of the top ten, five were young ladies; and again thanked General Helms for serving as a role model. 

 

 

 

Commissioner Voltz read aloud a resolution recognizing Centurion Mary Lee Moore Wilson. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to adopt Resolution proclaiming November 24, 2007 as Celebrate the Centurion Mary Lee Moore Wilson Day, and encouraging all who know her to celebrate with her this momentous occasion.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Commissioner Voltz presented the Resolution to Mary Lee Moore Wilson; and stated Ms. Wilson is present with many of her family members.  Commissioner Voltz inquired how one can become 100 years old; with Ms. Wilson responding the way to live to be 100 is to give God the glory; and she is glad to be here today.  

 

 

CITIZEN ACADEMY GRADUATION, RE:  FALL 2007 GRADUATION CLASS FOR BREVARD
     COUNTY CITIZENS ACADEMY                                                                                                                                     

Frank Abaleo of the Human Resources Office stated he is before the Board to ask that it recognize a special group of Brevard citizens who have attended and completed Brevard County Citizens Academy, which is an eight-week interactive learning experience.  He stated it meets once a week for three and a half hours and includes three Saturday field trips; the purpose is to offer unique opportunities to learn how the many Departments that fall under the County Manager’s office operate and provide insight as to how they function; and another function of the academy is to promote open lines of communication between the citizens, County staff, and County employees.  He stated the program also provides information on how
the citizens can utilize the services of County government; this is performed by having representatives of the Departments give an overview of their operations and responsibilities; and at the end of each presentation there is a question and answer period.  Mr. Abaleo stated during the eight weeks there always seem to be memorable moments; one of the classes was held at the Emergency Operation Center (EOC); he explained that when there is a crisis, all other County buildings are shut down and the EOC springs to action to keep the County operational, and that it is the safest place to be; but five minutes later the fire alarm went off and the building had to be evacuated.  He stated in the past he has commented on field trips to the Wastewater Treatment Plant with its 160 acres of wetlands; they have visited Country Acres, which is a children’s home; and he has talked about the tour of Brevard County’s Jail with its population of 1,700-plus.  He stated those are all very critical programs and are necessary to maintain the lifestyle everyone enjoys; but today he would like to bring attention to the many comments from the citizens on the dedication and professionalism of County employees who are involved in making this program work.  He stated he failed to mention this in the past; and today he wants to correct the situation and make not only the Board aware but also the employees themselves.  He expressed appreciation to the County employees; and stated every week the citizens reminded him of how much they appreciated the dedication and professionalism that was displayed throughout the program.  He stated five participants could not be present this morning,  Kyle Claridge of Melbourne, Kathy Emerson of Melbourne Beach, Judy and Rene Formoso of Cape Canaveral, and Chad Genoni of Melbourne;  and certificates were presented and the Board congratulated Bob Brett, Ron Brown, Doris Butler, Don Cappillettie, Stacey Claridge, David Cole, Virginia Dingley, Karen Enderle, Katherine Gordon, Al Graham, Barbara Graham, Harry Jacobs, Sherry Jacobs, Don Laird, Marlo Luciano, Marguerite Orban, John Paine, Dottie Reed, Evelyn Rost, Charles Settgast, Katherine Sorrell, Julie Torpy, Robert Wilkinson, and George Wolfe. 

 

Commissioner Bolin congratulated all the members of the Citizens Academy; and expressed special congratulations to Virginia Dingley whose husband is her Senior Aide Dave Dingley. 

 

Commissioner Voltz stated she received an email from Kathy Emerson who went through the program; and Ms. Emerson wanted to thank Carrie Cotter and Frank Abaleo.  She stated Ms. Emerson was very impressed with the Citizens Academy.

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated today the Commissioners want to recognize their staff, those people who are in the office.  He stated when they answer the phones they know a couple of things; first, the person probably did not know who else to call; second, that they have a problem; and staff needs to know everything about everybody in order to do their jobs. 

 

Commissioner Colon introduced her staff, Mary Redmond, Evelyn Guadalupe, and Rob Medina; and expressed appreciation to her staff for all that they do for her.  She expressed appreciation to the families of her staff.  She thanked her staff for treating the citizens with respect and dignity and for treating County staff with respect.  She stated Ms. Redmond, Ms. Guadalupe, and Mr. Medina go back to a time before politics; she wants to honor that friendship; and they were part of her family before she became a Council member in the City of Palm Bay.  She stated Ms. Redmond’s background was with Merrill Lynch in New York; Ms. Guadalupe came from the medical field; and Mr. Medina was in sales and marketing with the State.  She stated she also wants to thank the Jackie Colon Team; they started before politics; it was just them and their families; and now they have grown to 121 members who serve the community.  She stated it was humbling after September 11, knowing they had to step it up a notch; and expressed thanks to the Jackie Colon Team.  She commented on the events of September 11 and activities as a result.  She displayed Jackie Colon Team shirts. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated her staff is made of Dave Dingley, Susan Yonce, and Judy Capps.  She stated at the last minute Judy Capps asked to change her vacation from Christmas to Thanksgiving, so she will see a tape of the meeting.  She stated her staff took a leap of faith in coming to her office; they are through the first year; and expressed appreciation.  She stated she could not have done it without her staff; they are going to have three more wonderful exciting years; and her staff has not grounded her, but has let her soar.  She stated a secret is she allows Mr. Dingley to type on his computer everything he needs to get out of his system and then he hits the delete key; and joked her greatest fear is he will miss the delete key and hit send.  She stated Ms. Yonce is a delightful person; she is able to relate to the people on a level that she cannot because of her busy schedule; and thanked her. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated it is a pleasure to be able to give recognition to his staff, but two members are back at the office taking fire assessment and Waste Management calls.  He stated he is fortunate to have three intelligent bright folks working with him; they have done a great job; his District includes a lot of unincorporated area with a lot of population, so his office gets a lot of calls for almost city-type services; and one has to almost be a specialist to deal with many of the issues.  He stated Stephanie Smith is the first to take the calls; there is a new employee, Tyler Sirois, and Liz Alward who has been incredible in helping him get through the challenges and learning curve of the first year. 

 

Commissioner Voltz introduced Christopher Hill; and stated he does a great job.  She stated Mr. Hill has an English degree so he proofreads all her letters and paperwork; and it really helps.  She stated she met Mr. Hill seven years ago at his sister’s wedding, never thinking he would come to work for her; and then they met again right before the election when she was looking for staff.  She stated Tres Holton left her office; what she has done is split his job between Mr. Hill and Jan Conrad; and she hired a front office staff person.  She stated she met Jan Conrad at Dillards when she was running for election; they talked at length; and she offered her a job.  She stated her newest employee is Sharon Walker, who comes from Doug Beam’s office; she came on Ms. Conrad’s recommendation; and Sharon knows everybody.  She thanked her staff for doing a great job; and stated they have five more years to look forward to.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated no matter how stressed he is, his staff can relax him; and they are fantastic.  He expressed appreciation to his staff, Liz Lackovich, Kathy England, and Dottie Reed. 

 

Commissioner Voltz thanked Chairman Scarborough for allowing them to recognize their staff; and Chairman Scarborough thanked the Commissioners for participating. 

 

 

 

County Manager Peggy Busacca requested the Board approve running the United Way video until mid-December when the campaign comes to an end. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to grant permission to run the United Way video on Space Coast Government Television until mid-December 2007.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

 

Cindy Kelly, President of the Space Coast Art Festival, stated the Space Coast Art Festival, which is a 44-year tradition, kicks off on Thanksgiving morning with the 5K Turkey Trot and a Quarter-Mile Youth Run; on Friday will be the Judges’ Reception and a Street Party in downtown Cocoa Beach; and the art show will open at 9:00 a.m. on Saturday and run until 5:00 p.m. and then on Sunday it will run from 10:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.  She stated one of the things they are proud of is the growth of the student art show, which consists of over 200 entries from students throughout the County; every year they invite students from grades K-12; and there is a contest for students for the volunteer shirts.  She stated this year there was such a great selection that it was hard to pick, so they decided to create a poster with the three top winners; and displayed the poster.  She stated the winners included students from Rockledge High, R. L. Stevenson Elementary, and Hoover Middle School; and she has a copy of the poster for each of the Commissioners.  She displayed the winning poster for the entire show, which was done by artist Bruce Reynolds from Cocoa Beach; and advised she has copies of that poster for the Commissioners as well.  She advised this year the Judges’ Party will be held on Friday evening at the home of the Sheffields in Cocoa Beach; and presented the Commissioners with invitations to attend the party. 

 

Chairman Scarborough requested Ms. Kelly advise of the dates and place one more time; with Ms. Kelly repeating the information.  Ms. Kelly advised anyone interested in additional information can phone 784-3322, which is the Art Festival office.  Chairman Scarborough stated she is sure a lot of people will be there; with Ms. Kelly responding usually there are 30,000 to 50,000 attendees.  She presented the Commissioners with posters and tote bags. 

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated County Manager Peggy Busacca suggested the Board meet upstairs to have a conversation; but he understands Commissioner Voltz has other commitments.  Commissioner Voltz advised she does not.  Chairman Scarborough thanked Ms. Busacca for setting it up for the Board; and stated for anyone who wants to participate, it will be discussion of the Commissioners about some of the concerns it has and directions it needs to take.  He stated the Board is facing multiple issues; he cannot recall any time the Board had so many issues; and it has the space shuttle, the gap, decline in the construction industry, potential of inflation, increased gas prices affecting tourism, and potential of shift in defense spending, which could impact those defense industries that are located in South Brevard.  He stated the Commissioners have a lot of concern; he knows the public does as well; the meeting will give the Board an opportunity to visit on some of the thoughts it needs to pursue; and it will be held upstairs after this meeting.

 

 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated she has a medal around her neck today because she went to the Suntree Elementary School, which has received the Blue Ribbon Award that is given to only 13 schools in the State of Florida; every student got an award; and they were gracious enough to give her one also.  She stated she is very proud of the school’s accomplishments. 

 

 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated there was a Paws in the Park at Wickham Park; her Aide Dave Dingley was the judge of the dogs; and she guesses he did well as he came back with no bites.

 

 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated on Sunday she was also honored to be at the tenth birthday party of the Suntree Library; she got to see the history of the library; and it has come a long way from a storefront in the Suntree area. 

 

 

 

Commissioner Bolin thanked the Board for its vote of confidence by selecting her as the Vice Chairman; and stated she will try to serve Commissioner Scarborough as best she can as his backup.

 

 

 

Commissioner Colon stated she and her staff attended a celebration of Junny Rios-Martinez this weekend; it was a celebration of his life and did not focus on anything that was negative; but cautioned it is important for the community to be vigilant on what goes on in the community.  She stated when she makes certain comments, folks say they cannot believe she said those things; but she does not apologize for saying that she considers folks that touch a child to be animals and monsters.  She stated she knows from the latest blogs that there are certain folks who are upset because she has called them that; but that is what they are when they do those things to a child because the young person will be affected for the rest of his or her life.  She stated the weekend was incredible; the Sheriff and State Attorney were there; the focus on Junny Rios-Martinez brought them together; and his legacy will continue in Brevard County.  She stated one of the things she said is that when the enemy tries to something to bring evil to the community, God is able to turn it around and turn it into goodness; and that is what happened this weekend.  She stated they were able to celebrate Junny Rios-Martinez’ life, bring the community together, and be conscious that there are people around who would want to hurt children, but that Brevard County will not allow that, and that message was very clear thanks to the Rios-Martinez family.  She stated Mr. Martinez was part of a band in his younger days; there were some wonderful jazz musicians that came from all over the country to be there this for the Rios-Martinez family; and thanked everyone who flew in from out-of-town to be part of this wonderful celebration of a beautiful young person who will continue to live with all of us. 

 

 

Commissioner Colon advised of attending an event put together by Commander George Taylor and Isaac Ramos to honor Glen Griffin, an 88-year old veteran who served in Normandy on D-Day.  She stated Congressman Tom Feeney presented the Purple Heart to Mr. Griffin; and Mr. Griffin’s family, including 31 grandchildren and great grandchildren were present for the celebration.  She stated it was an incredible feeling to be able to have that kind of history and be part of that room; and the Pastor, who was a Vietnam veteran, was very emotional and thanked Mr. Griffin, advising he served in Vietnam and it was nothing compared to what Mr. Griffin went through in Normandy.  She stated a lady from France read that Mr. Griffin was going to be the recipient of the Purple Heart; and she came to honor him with a medal on behalf of the French people to thank him.  She stated the people of France are free because of the United States of America and the veterans who were willing to sacrifice their lives; and it reminded her that right now with all the criticism that is going on in Iraq that some day they will hear testimonials of the Iraqi people thanking the veterans who were willing to sacrifice their lives for someone else.  She stated this is not about whether one supports the war or not, but giving thanks to the men and women who sacrificed their lives for people they did not even know.  She stated it was incredible to have someone who came from France, but is now an American citizen, thanking someone who was part of the war; it was an incredible day to be an American and witness that; and thanked everyone who put the ceremony together.  She stated Mr. Griffin at 88 years old wanted his Purple Heart; he deserved it; and Congressman Feeney was able to give it to him.  She stated Mr. Griffin is an incredible role model; and it was an exciting weekend.       

 

 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to grant permission to use the current Chairman’s signature plates for signing the Payroll and Accounts Payable checks until new signature plates can be obtained with the new Chairman’s signature.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously.  

 

 

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to confirm the appointment of Heidi A. Denis as Assistant County Manager for the Community Services Group.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

 

Sarah Ann Conkling congratulated Commissioner Scarborough, who is her Commissioner, on his new role as Chairman; and thanked Commissioner Colon for the job she did in the prior year.  She stated she has watched the Board on television, but has never been before it speaking before; and there is a financial issue that is serious.  She stated she received her tax bill; she enjoys Save our Homes and enjoys relatively low taxes because of that and homestead exemption; and she depends on that as a low income homeowner.  She stated when she received her tax bill, it had $550 in ad valorem taxes and over $450 in assessment fees, which woke her up; she saw that the fire service fee was included; she was exempted from that last year; and she thought she had just forgotten to put in the paperwork, so she called the Fire Department to get an exemption from that fee again.  Ms. Conkling stated that started a series of phone calls to the Tax Collector, Property Appraiser, the Fire Department a couple of times, and finally to Commissioner Scarborough’s office; and that is why she is here today.  She stated there was a financial issue that came before the Board where the Fire Service funding was removed from the ad valorem revenue stream and put into a special assessment; this was done because the Grinch, known as the State Attorney, struck down the exemption for low income homeowners; and at that point the Board’s intention to make something everybody could afford to pay was negated.  She stated once the State Attorney said the Board could not exempt the low income homeowners, everyone got the same bill, which was not the intention of the Board; and there is obviously a legal issue with the Grinch.  She stated the Grinch has said the Board has to do this in a uniform manner; and the reason she is before the Board is because she feels it is a moral issue.  She stated they are coming up on Thanksgiving; she is thankful for being in Brevard County, for being an American, and for living in a beautiful place with people who care about all of the citizens, especially the low income citizens; and at this time of year they have to “do” thankful as well as “be” thankful, which means the fee either has to be eliminated with the funding put back in the ad valorem revenue or it has to be restructured in a way so that it fairly represents the fire risk to the structures that are being taxed.  She stated the fairest thing to do is to restore Fire Service funding to the ad valorem base; that is what the County had for a million years and it worked great; and nobody squawked or got unfairly taxed.  She stated the way the current fee is structured, the low square footage condo owners are subsidizing the high square footage condo owners, and all of the condo owners are subsidizing the detached homeowners; and it is completely unfair and an undue burden on low income homeowners.  She advised most low income people cannot afford homes; she was able to acquire her home before she got a disability and had to cut back on her work; and she is before the Board for all those people who are fortunate enough to own a home and do not want to lose it because a fee that was meant to be fair and exempt people like her is now being assessed at a rate that many low income homeowners cannot afford to pay.  She urged the Board to either restore Fire Service funding to the ad valorem base or to restructure the fee; and stated there are a couple of ways it could do that.  She stated the Board could limit all assessments to a certain percentage of taxes; if her ad valorem bill is $550, it could limit her assessments to 10% or 15% of that so her personal chunk of that would be proportional to her tax bill; or the Board could restructure the fee and do away with it being based on square footage.  She stated if she had a 1,000 square-foot condo, she would pay a fifth of what a 5,000 square-foot condo owner would pay; that would be more fair than what is happening now where all condo owners are paying the same fee; but the fairest, most equitable, most courageous thing the Board could do is to restore Fire Service funding to the ad valorem revenue stream.  She stated that is the most fair option for all taxpayers, especially the low income taxpayers who cannot afford this fee. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Board is very concerned about this; and while Ms. Conkling may be the only one speaking on it this morning, it is a subject that is being discussed widely.  He inquired where are they and where can they go.  County Attorney Scott Knox advised he first wants to identify the Grinch as the Attorney General, not the State Attorney; and the second thing is that staff has put together a proposed revision to the Statute where this Grinch-like decision came from to allow any board that has this kind of program to go through a low income exception similar to what Ms. Conkling had, to start up the process for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is that assessments have to be based on benefit and assessments have certain limitations.  He stated there are certain limitations on whether they can transfer money from assessments back to the ad valorem roll because of what the Legislature did last year in terms of limiting ability to raise taxes; the proposed amendment will be brought to the Board as part of the legislative proposal; and he would strongly recommend that Ms. Conkling’s testimonial today be transcribed and presented as part of that package. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated when the Board presents something it is legalistic, cold, and impersonal; but when people come to talk personally to the Legislative Delegation it gives life to the conversation; so when the Legislative meeting is held, it would be good for persons in the community to come.  He inquired what the date of the Legislative meeting is; with Mr. Knox responding he does not know, but Leigh Holt is working on it.  County Manager Peggy Busacca advised as it stands right now, the Legislative Program policies will be provided to the Board and discussed on November 27, 2007 and December 18, 2007 is scheduled for the workshop; however, the Delegation has requested a change to that date, so it is about to be cancelled, but has not been formally done yet.  Chairman Scarborough stated the Board needs to let people know when it will be so they can be part of the discussion. 

 

Ms. Conkling thanked the Board; and stated the Legislature has an abysmal record on passing tax relief for low income homeowners so a Plan B is needed in case the Legislative proposal dies in committee.  She requested the Board be prepared to do something else to make the assessment fairer or to restore it to the ad valorem stream if the Legislative proposal falls on deaf ears. 

 

Commissioner Voltz stated a number of weeks or even months ago, the Board talked about the fact that the information it got from the Attorney General was not a formal opinion, and the Board asked to have a formal opinion; and inquired if that has been received.  Mr. Knox stated he does not think the Board asked for that, but he will be glad to ask for it.  Commissioner Voltz stated the Board needs to do that to make sure, because what it has is not really a formal opinion from the Attorney General. 

 

Ms. Conkling stated she is also concerned about that because they have limited resources and have to choose what they do with the limited resources; and she is concerned, as a citizen, about spending their regulatory resources on this rather than a million other things which would have been more of a benefit to the State.  She stated Attorney General struck down the intention of the Board to be able to help low income homeowners and also have a fair assessment; she does not understand why that is being done; but she appreciates the Board following up and solving the problem.       

 

Commissioner Voltz stated the majority of those people who qualified for the exemption live in her District, so they are eager for the Board to do something else; and she appreciates Ms. Conkling coming forward. 

 

Mr. Knox inquired if it is the desire of the Board that he seek an official Attorney General’s Opinion.

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to direct the County Attorney to request a formal Attorney General Opinion as to the legality of an exemption from the Fire Assessment for low income homeowners.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously.   

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough called for the public hearing to consider an ordinance amending Chapter 62, Article X, Division 3, Surface Water Protection and Chapter 62, Article XIII, Division 2, Landscaping, Land Clearing, and Tree Protection. 

 

Mary Lou Stearns stated she wants to tell the Board how this ordinance recently affected her; she just finished building a home on two and one-half acres that she has owned for twenty years; prior to the building, there was a small house on the property that was removed; but during the construction she never took out any trees or shrubs.  She stated there was a tree survey; she has between 50 and 70 trees, some of which are native Florida plants; she has a lot of plants on the property; and there is also a pond that encompasses a half-acre and is surrounded by trees and plants.  She stated she just found out recently from the Office of Natural Resources Management that she will have to plant 358 fifteen-inch, three-gallon plants due to the Ordinance as it stands now; she went to nurseries to try to find out the cost; and the cost is over $4,000.  She stated she spent $1,500 on a landscaping plan through her contractor; she planted between 35 and 40 plants surrounding the home; and it is completed.  She stated if the amendment the Board is considering goes through, she was told by Natural Resources staff that she only have to plant 191 fifteen-inch, three-gallon plants at a cost of approximately $2,600.  She requested a waiver or exemption from this requirement; stated she did complete all of the paperwork; her Notice of Commencement was signed and notarized on October 24, 2006, which is the day the Board considered the Ordinance last year; so she had the paperwork done before the Ordinance was adopted.  She stated she understands the need for preservation of trees; and she kept all her trees and added to them.  She stated she was given information about the purpose and intent of the Ordinance; and it says “to provide regulations that are user friendly, flexible, and minimize conflicts with other Land Development Regulations while protecting property rights.”  She stated she feels she was doing her part in trying to keep the vegetation and add to it; she budgeted carefully to build the home; and as she is a widow, the added expense is going to be a hardship. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated he has been corresponding with Ms. Stearns by email; he can understand if a lot is cleared, materials brought in, and the lot is elevated; but if someone has tried to protect the existing native vegetation and has not cleared, it seems the requirements are excessive.  He inquired what the original intent was.  He stated he understands if someone cleared for a lot, that portion of the lot would be subject to the landscaping and shrub requirement; but inquired why would they do that for a lot of two and one-half acres if only a quarter-acre is disturbed. 

 

Natural Resources Management Director Ernie Brown advised the landscaping requirements are based on the actual buildable area that is submitted, so while Ms. Stearns may have a two and one-half acre lot, the actual site that was being looked at may have been a half-acre or three-quarters of an acre and that is actually the area staff would be looking at.  Commissioner Nelson inquired if Mr. Brown is saying buildable or cleared; with Mr. Brown responding anything that is cleared is going to be considered part of the buildable area.  Commissioner Nelson inquired is it only disturbed area or is it buildable in the sense that the rest of the yard could be buildable.  Mr. Brown responded anything within the limits of disturbance; so if there is a 16-acre parcel, but the proposal is only to disturb a quarter or half acre that is what the buildable area actually is.  He stated that is what staff looks at as far as the landscaping requirements; that can be increased to incorporate portions of the property that have native understory, which counts toward credit for both preservation of trees, landscaping credits, and shrub credit; so there is a certain amount of native or natural understory that can be credited toward shrubs.  Mr. Brown stated the way it is designed and presented is all dependent upon how large of a disturbed area one is actually impacting, not, in this context, the lot size.  He stated whether it is two and one-half acres, sixteen acres, a thousand acres, or a quarter-acre is irrelevant as it relates to how staff looks at the site; and it is what the actual disturbed area is.  He stated the limits of disturbance equal what they call buildable area; and in that context, he does not know what Ms. Stearns size of lot of buildable area was, but it is usually about a half-acre.  He stated preserving trees outside that buildable area can be done if they want to expand the buildable area; but staff does not look at that as the area disturbed; and the area disturbed and landscaping requirements are based on what is actually impacted.  He stated in the current Ordinance, which the Board specifically asked for a reduction to the shrub requirements, there are two provisions that allow a reduction; one is taking advantage of the existing understory; and the second is to move to xeriscaping which can give a 50% reduction.  He stated the previous Ordinance, prior to the change in October 2006, is about where Ms. Stearns would be with the xeriscape requirement or the proposed ordinance.  Commissioner Nelson inquired if the house was knocked down or burned down and Ms. Stearns rebuilt a house in the same footprint, what would the impact be; with Mr. Brown responding she would need to come up to Code.  Commissioner Nelson inquired if she could have a fully manicured yard, but now would have to put in all sorts of additional plants because of the Code requirement, even though she would be replacing like with like.  Mr. Brown stated in the current Code, if she was expanding it more than 25%, she would have to come up to Code; if she is actually doing like for like, then she would not; and the new Code actually has a 50% increase if structures are being expanded by 50% of the pre-existing, which would mean it would have to come up to Code.  He stated that is one of the proposals before the Board today; but to answer the question, if it is exactly the same footprint, the same house being rebuilt, then there would not be additional requirements.  Commissioner Nelson stated what he is hearing is that it comes down to the disturbed area; that is the criteria; and if it not the two and one-half acres; but Ms. Stearns will need to consult with staff to make sure they have looked at it.  He noted it still sounds high; with Mr. Brown advising it may be and staff can look at that with Ms. Stearns after this is discussed and a decision made by the Board.  Mr. Brown stated if Ms. Stearns submitted her applications prior to the effective date of the Ordinance, which is October 24, 2006, and her application was substantially complete prior to that date, then she should have been given the opportunity to use either/or; but he does not know where her application was actually signed and whether it was on or before that date, but he will look into it and work with Ms. Stearns to work through those issues.  He stated depending on how the Board goes today, they may be able to go back and revise if that is what the Board would like staff to do. 

 

George Kramer, with Glatting Jackson Kercher and Anglin, representing The Viera Company, commended County staff for their work both on the existing Ordinance and on the proposed amendment.  He stated most of the Board has seen the concepts that were created for the West Viera Plan; those are consistent with Policy 8.3 of the Conservation Element that talks about cluster development and connected open space; and they have identified some obstacles with the cluster development and the ordinance.  He stated in talking with County staff, they were asked to address that through their Comprehensive Plan amendment rather than amendments to the proposed ordinance; and they are happy to do that and are continuing to work with staff on the language.  He advised they are scheduled for Comprehensive Plan amendment
transmittal consideration on December 4, 2007; and so they will be looking at the issues through that rather than the proposed ordinance. 

 

Commissioner Bolin commented on Mr. Kramer working on this last night until 11:00 p.m.

 

Maureen Rupe stated she agrees with the LPA and the BCAC’s recommendations on the shrub issue; but on page 7, in the protected tree definition, she has concerns with the “recognized knowledgeable person.”  She stated it leaves it open to interpretation, especially with the words “such as”; and recommended it be taken out and made more specific as to who makes this determination.  She stated they know that Ernie Brown could be considered a recognized knowledgeable person but he is not a certified arborist.  She stated she was on the Land Task Force; and she was not so concerned about this wording, but she sees the future now a little more clearly.  She stated they have been working with Mr. Kramer; and The Viera Company is going to want to clear a lot of trees for their villages.  She stated another example is the tree listing on the plan for the hotel site on S.R. 520 on Lake Poinsett that came before the Board at its last meeting; the plan showed the dbh requirements for a single tree but did not consider a group of trees could be considered a specimen tree, although the lot is heavily wooded between the trees with 24 dbh or greater; and she would like it to be more defined, not leaving horticulturists’ and developers’ plan specialists making the decisions.  She stated the recognized knowledgeable person is given authority in quite a few things besides the trees through the proposed ordinance; and it would be a good idea to have a little more clarification.  She stated the Board may not see a problem there, in which case she will be happy to come back when it happens and point it out. 

 

Mr. Brown stated the recognized knowledgeable person discussion that transpired with the Task Force was very laborious; it is a challenge; and what it is designed to do is to bring forth people that have experience to where they can bring expertise to bear on what is a specimen tree and developing landscape plans for development.  He stated it is a challenge because there is a suite of professional fields that can employ this; and he is willing to look at it in greater detail and work with the industry to see if there is a way to improve it.  He noted that will take some time; it could be several months of meetings and discussions; and he is hesitant to have a knee jerk solution today because that would be a disservice to the Board and to the community; but if the Board would like, they can engage in some discussions with the professional community to try to tighten it up.

 

Commissioner Voltz stated Mr. Brown spoke earlier about the disturbed area and the buildable area; if there is a two and one-half acre lot and the whole lot is able to be built on, then the whole lot is buildable.  She inquired if she comes in and shows the footprint of her house, where is the line that says this is now not buildable.  Mr. Brown responded when people come in for development for single-family houses, they come in with a plot plan and define the areas of disturbance; so they may have a two and one-half acre parcel or a five-acre parcel, but it is only the area they are saying they are saying they are going to disturb.  He stated they are further defining that in the proposed area to make it very clear that it is the limits of disturbance; but as it currently stands right now, if someone has a two and one-half acre lot, when they come in for a plot plan to build the home, they identify the area that will be disturbed.  He stated they have to disturb a certain amount of the property for lot drainage, septic, driveway, pool, or whatever is being built, so there are areas that are being disturbed; that buildable area does not say that 80% of the two and one-half acres is buildable, although that may be true; and it only looks at the area that is being proposed to be disturbed.  Mr. Brown stated the applicant has the ability to increase or reduce that as they see fit for the application purposes; for example, they may want to include a stand of trees to meet their landscaping, so it would expand it from the quarter-acre to a little bit more to incorporate that and say it satisfies the landscaping requirement; and they have the flexibility to do that.  Commissioner Voltz stated her next question is about manufactured homes; there have been a number of issues in Barefoot Bay; and their acreage is one-sixth or one-seventh acre.  Mr. Brown advised .1 acre is not uncommon in Barefoot Bay.  Commissioner Voltz stated they have to put more plants than they have room; the ordinance talks about the progression that may be parts of individual lots; and she does not know if it stops at quarter-acre lots.  Mr. Brown stated staff heard that loud and clear not only from the Board, but also from the citizens at the public forums; and on page 19 of the document, a proposal has been created which has a sliding scale to address the issue.  He stated it goes down to lots that are greater than .1 acre but less than .15 acre and has less requirements for both shrubs and trees than a one-acre lot would have.  He stated they created a sliding scale to accommodate that because staff recognizes there were some difficulties putting five trees on a .1 acre manufactured home parcel; and they worked with a number of manufactured home installers to see what would work realistically.  He stated they recognize a need to have some vegetation, but there needed to be some reasonable application based on the constricted site; and they came up with this, working with the community to accommodate but still insure the intent of the ordinance was intact.  Commissioner Voltz stated Ms. Rupe brought up having more of a professional determine what is to be on a lot and what can be planted; but that would be putting a burden on an individual homeowner or even a developer to do that.  She stated if a developer pays for that, it will be passed on to the homeowner; and she is concerned about the homeowners having to pay those extra costs.  She stated if they can have specifics in the ordinance suggesting what to plant, she does not see any reason to have any professionals; and she is sure if it is a big development, they will already have those kinds of people on staff.  She stated for homeowners building homes themselves, having a professional and those fees would be expensive; and the individual should be able to look at the ordinance and see what they need to do and the kinds of trees they need to plant.  Mr. Brown stated Commissioner Voltz hit it right on the head; the homeowners have the option of doing their own plan; staff helps when they come through the single-family residential process; and they are not required to get a recognized knowledgeable person.  He stated there have been numerous places where site development has had challenges in getting the right tree in the right place because of the complexities of utilities, easements, and impervious areas associated with the site plan or subdivision development; and it is essential to have somebody with expertise in that landscaping and putting the right tree in the right place to assist with development to make sure it is sustainable in that regard.  He stated site plans and site development requires that, but single-family homeowners do not.

 

Ryan Rusnak stated he has come to speak on the ordinance mostly as it applies to commercial; the definition of root protection zone (RPZ) calls out for certain protection zones around large, medium, and small trees; and with a large tree, it requires a sixteen and a half foot radius around the tree.  He stated it is his understanding with the current Ordinance, especially with commercial, it requires 10% preserved canopy and 10% planted tree canopy; with preserved canopy being maintained on the site, one has to respect the RPZ; however, with the current ordinance the RPZ does not have to be respected if one wants to claim credit for those trees for planted trees.  He stated specifically where that comes into conflict is when there is a sixteen and a half foot radius and type A buffers, which are 20-foot buffers to a rear setback; typically with commercial one puts a wall back there and maybe has the building at 20 feet; or with type B buffers, which is a 15-foot roadway setback, putting a sidewalk along the street is an impossibility.  Mr. Rusnak submitted pictures to the Board. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if they are the same pictures or different ones; with Mr. Rusnak advising they are the same. 

 

Mr. Rusnak stated the pictures show Hibiscus Office Park, which his company developed; they were able to design the parking lots around the large oak trees; and it is his understanding that under the current ordinance, they would not be able to claim credit for those as preserved canopy or planted canopy.  He stated it becomes difficult if there is a tree; the public wants them to preserve as many trees as possible onsite; but none of the islands have a sixteen and a half foot radius.  He stated they design islands around a parking lot; they are trying to preserve; but the ordinance is essentially saying thanks for preserving but you are not getting credit for it.  He stated with more and more marginal lands being developed, they are required to bring in much more fill; and this is a tough ordinance with the 10% preservation and 10% planted.  He stated it lacks a certain amount of flexibility; if they are talking about an urban infill development, they are essentially beating down the square footage of commercial square footage that a developer could get; and there is a natural saturation with respect to how much commercial square footage an area can support, so they are making that square footage smaller on one side and promoting urban sprawl down the road.   

 

Bruce Moia, MBV Engineering, stated he is sorry to report after 25 years of development, he is no longer a knowledgeable individual according to the ordinance.  He stated it is a very difficult ordinance; they struggle with it a lot; and they always employ a landscape architect when they do site plans now because it is difficult to figure out these sites.  He stated they have some issues with the root protection zone; he spoke to Mr. Brown about this; and he does not know if it was corrected, but there was some conflict if there were heat islands.  He stated the requirement for a heat island is to put a large or medium tree; but the protection zone is up to 360% larger than the requirement for a heat island.  He stated with a heat island, normally they would take out a parking space and put in a grassed area, but if they want to plant a tree there, it will not be big enough any more, so there is a conflict in the ordinance.  He stated when they have trees, they have to have a distance back from them in order to preserve to make sure it remains a good tree for growth; but they have seen many cases where they can build a lot closer to trees than is being allowed in the ordinance.  He stated Mr. Rusnak touched on not getting credit for preserving more than the requirements; if they have a commercial site where they want to put in 20% instead of 10% and 10%, there is no credit; and then they also have to make up for the mitigation if they do take down certain trees, so not only are they preserving 20%, but then they have to mitigation in addition to that 150% or up to 200% with the ordinance if they do a specimen tree.  He stated they are finding it to be extremely tough to implement the ordinance; and if, for example, they have a commercial site and decide to preserve 20%, they then have 15% for retention, heat islands and buffers; and it gets down to where there is not that much buildability on the lot.  He stated where this gets really touch is where there is a wooded site; they are doing one right now on U.S. 1 in Port St. John; the lot is completely wooded; and for preserving the 20%, they are being penalized in addition to all the mitigation to the point where they figure the cost of just mitigation for the areas in the building will be over $150,000 for a two-acre site.  Mr. Moia stated it is difficult; it is expensive; and they are not even sure the project is going to go forward because of that expense.  He stated there is no credit for preserving on a site where there are extremely wooded conditions; if there is a sparsely wooded site, it is a lot easier; and he thinks there should be some credit for doing extra preservation; and commented on mitigation and having room onsite to replant trees that are taken out.  He stated they are concerned about the root protection zone and preservation; they would like to have some flexibility to preserve more; the goal is to preserve existing canopy not to plant it; and if that is really a goal, they should get some credit for it.       

 

Mr. Brown stated Mr. Rusnak and Mr. Moia have some very valid points; Mr. Rusnak’s issue was addressed in the changes in the proposal; but the comments brought up by Mr. Moia need more work. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated Mr. Brown came by his office yesterday and they went through every possible change; and he needs to sit down with staff again.  He stated this is too important; if it is not done right, it will have to come back; and he would like to talk to Mr. Moia, Mr. Rusnak, and the other speakers.  He thanked staff for the good work; but stated he would be more comfortable if he had a little more time.   

 

Motion by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to continue the public hearing to consider an ordinance amending Chapter 62, Article X, Division 3, Surface Water Protection and Chapter 62, Article XIII, Division 2, Landscaping, Land Clearing, and Tree Protection. 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired what the rush is.  Mr. Brown responded there are a lot of changes that have been addressed that need to be resolved; it is a continued impact on the community; they have identified changes that need to be made; and the further they delay it, the more people will be dealing with an old Ordinance.  He stated that is the only issue; they can keep going with this; what they proposed last year was that they were going to be dealing with continuous changes every year; and that is the nature of the beast.  He stated as they get more science and more implementation data, staff will be bringing it back periodically; and this is up to the pleasure of the Board.  Chairman Scarborough stated they are getting into the holidays; there are some meetings in December; and inquired if January would be impossible; with Mr. Brown responding it is however the Board would like to proceed, and the problems are going to continue to exist. 

 

Commissioner Voltz inquired how many people are waiting in the wings for these changes; with Mr. Brown responding there are a handful of existing bonds out there.  Mr. Brown stated people will be coming in during the next two months, although as it is the holiday season that should be low; if this were to be enacted during the next two hearings, they would be able to change and move forward, so it is not that much of an impact; and that is the only true ramification.  He stated the world is not going to end if it is not done today; it is a continued process; and the Board has to recognize that whatever decision it makes, staff is going to have to bring back some more changes, and it will be a continuous process for this particular document. 

 

Commissioner Bolin inquired how West Viera is going to be affected.  Mr. Brown advised the DRI expansion will have to be addressed in the Comprehensive Plan because of the
uniqueness of the development; and they have agreed to do that.  Mr. Brown stated cluster development is going to have to be dealt with differently; and once that is vetted out in the Comprehensive plan, it will be necessary to amend the Ordinances to address cluster mixed use developments. 

 

Motion restated by Commissioner Voltz, seconded by Commissioner Bolin, to continue the public hearing to consider an ordinance amending Chapter 62, Article X, Division 3, Surface Water Protection and Chapter 62, Article XIII, Division 2, Landscaping, Land Clearing, and Tree Protection to January 2, 2008.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

 

Natural Resources Management Director Ernie Brown stated Eddie Leonard will introduce the presentation; he is the Marine Agent with the University of Florida Extension Program; he works with Jim Fletcher; and they have been the catalyst to move this forward.  He stated in 2005 when the Board asked to start moving forward with this project, Natural Resources Management quickly employed outside expertise, so a lot of people worked through this process; and it was a fantastic product.      

 

Eddie Leonard, Marine Agent with the University of Florida Extension Program, stated the experts from the University of Florida are present to go over the project; the Extension Service is very proud to be a part of this; and the result turned out very good.  He stated this represents a partnership between a lot of different groups; it is important to illustrate that this has been a partnership not only between the Extension Service and the University of Florida, but also the Board of County Commissioners and the Brevard Marine Advisory Council, with significant financial and advisory support from the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission; and the Natural Resources Management Office and Parks and Recreation did a great deal of the legwork in the beginning stages of the project.  He stated the project should provide a lot of insight into scientific background for some of the problems from the Comprehensive Maritime Management Master Plan; and introduced Dr. Charles Sidman from the University of Florida.

 

Dr. Charles Sidman stated he would like to share with the Board some of the methods and findings of the recreational boating study that was implemented approximately a year and a half ago; it represents the fourth of a series of characterization studies that have employed a similar methodology; the previous three implementations were for Tampa Bay, Sarasota County, and for the greater Charlotte Harbor region; and they have just embarked on a study for the St. Andrew Bay area with support from the Bay County Planning Department.  He stated the goals behind the study were to engage the boating public, make them a part of the planning process, and promote a science-based data-driven method that could be used to support waterway planning efforts in the County.  He stated the specific objectives of the study were to quantify and map public waterway access facility use and document the preferences, activities, and use patterns of the boating public using Brevard County waterways; and some of the questions to be answered included who are the boaters, where are they coming from to access Brevard County waterways, where and how do they access the water, where do they travel on the water, and what activities are conducted at their favorite destinations.  He stated for the purpose of the study they targeted users of four primary waterway access facility types, marina wet slips, dry storage facilities, public ramps, and private docks; and they basically identified boaters that used those four access facilities by canvassing marinas and boat ramps.  Dr. Sidman stated throughout the course of the study, they visited 28 of 34 participating marinas; there they canvassed the dry storage facilities and the wet slips; they collected bow numbers from boats; and those bow numbers were used to obtain names and mailing addresses.  He stated in addition Brevard County Parks and Recreation Department canvassed 30 public boat ramps over 54 sample days; they collected tag numbers from cars and trailers observed at the parking lots; and through those tag numbers, they were able to obtain names and mailing addresses for ramp users.  He stated over the 54 sample days they collected 22,000 tag numbers, 9,500 of which were unique, so there were a number of repeat users; and dock owners were identified by comparing vessel title registration records with Property Appraiser information to identify those waterfront parcel owners that also owned boats.  He noted they determined the best way to capture special and behavioral information on boating trips was to implement a map based boaters survey; and displayed a graphic showing both sides of the survey.  He advised approximately 18,000 of the surveys were mailed in three waves to capture seasonal use in the County; the survey recipients were asked to trace on the map the routes of their last two trips; and in doing so they marked their departure sites and favorite destinations as well as the activities they conducted at those destinations.  He stated a series of question on the reverse side elicited information regarding the timing, frequency, duration of the trips, reasons for selecting boating access facilities, and perceived problems and solutions to problems.  He stated information from the map based portion of the survey was entered into a geographic information system; and displayed graphics showing the GIS map query and display functionality by illustrating the raw data that was collected and features traced on the maps by survey recipients.  He displayed a graphic showing the Merritt Island area; and stated the red dots reflect departure sites, green dots show favorite destinations, and a subset of favorite destinations associated with nature viewing is shown in yellow.  He commented on the versatility of the data once in a geographic information system; and stated approximately 3,300 to 3,400 returns were usable, representing a 19% return rate.  He stated additional GIS functionality allows them to map boating use hot spots in the form of primary destinations and congested areas within the GIS; and displayed a graphic showing a close-up of the Merritt Island area, with boating destination hot spots shown.  He stated the popular destinations such as Bird Island, Party Island, and Ski Island were validated by aerial reconnaissance; information collected as part of the ramp surveys and marina surveys also allowed them to map where boaters live relative to the facilities they use; and displayed a graphic showing the distribution of Brevard County ramp and marina patrons.  He stated patrons from 54 of 67 counties were observed using Brevard County boat ramps; and that translates to approximately 54% of the boaters who use the County’s ramps are visitors from other counties in Florida.  He stated conversely they found that approximately two-thirds of the marina patrons actually reside within Brevard County; information collected as part of the ramp inventory allowed them to measure the capacity of the ramps relative to the use profiles of the ramps; and displayed a table comparing the number of parking spaces available at a selection of ramps relative to the average number of trailers observed during peak use, shoulder periods, and off-peak periods.  He stated capacity is being met or exceeded at Freddie Patrick, Kennedy Point, and the Main Street boat docks in Sebastian Inlet; but ramps are also identified as being underutilized during certain times of the year where additional use might be accommodated.  He stated an important element of the study was to identify the descriptive information about the boaters and their trips; and the typical boater respondent is a year-round resident, approximately 54 years of age, takes two to three boating trips per month, and owns a 22-foot powerboat.  He stated 87% of the respondents owned a powerboat; 13% owned a sailboat; the typical respondent had a boater education or seamanship course; and they had approximately 20 years of boating experience.  Dr. Sidman stated approximately 40% of the respondents indicated that they have left or avoided their favorite locations on the water due to congestion or perceived congestion; and the typical respondent also perceived that a lack of seamanship, boating knowledge, or common courtesy; excessive regulations in the form of speed zones, particularly manatee speed zones; and the lack of access detract most from their recreational boating experiences.  He displayed a table representing the general responses; and stated there were significant differences in the types of detractors that floated to the top depending on which waterway access group they were talking about.  He stated for those boaters that accessed the water through private docks, the imposition of speed zones was the primary detractor; but for users of ramps and marinas it was a lack of courtesy and seamanship.  He stated overall the lack of courtesy and seamanship was the prime detractor.  He stated the typical respondent believes that more ramps, better ramp parking, channel marking and dredging, as well as fewer speed zones, are needed most to improve their recreational boating experiences.  He stated environmental protection in the form of better water quality was also highly rated.  He stated in terms of where they go from here, the information that has been collected as part of the initial study can be used to help plan for public access in Brevard County waterways; and one aspect is to determine who uses each of the County ramps and marina facilities to determine what the market and service areas are for particular boat ramps.  He stated they want to know where they come from to access specific boat ramps and where they boat on the water; and they also want to forecast who will use County ramps and marinas in the future.  He displayed a graphic illustrating a first pass at a delineation of a market area for a particular boat ramp; advised they selected the Freddie Patrick Boat Ramp in the Cape Canaveral area; and the areas highlighted in blue represent the primary service areas for the ramp.  He stated using the information they have collected in combination with some trend analysis of boat registration date, they can estimate what the future demand is going to be for particular boat ramps; boat ramps have unique personalities; some ramps attract from large geographic areas and disperse that use over large areas on the water; but some ramps attract a much more localized patronage and target that use to specific areas on the water.  He stated they would also like to compare information that has been collected on boating patterns with environmental features such as the presence of manatees as well as seagrass beds; and using the information collected as part of the market area analysis as well as the environmental analysis, the culmination of the project would be to identify specific locations on the land and water that are most compatible with boating and the environment. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated besides being good information, this has a much broader purpose; one of the things that jumped out to him was the 54% utilization of boating facilities by non-County residents; and that becomes a statewide issue because, in effect, the County would not need additional boat ramps if it could keep everybody else in the State out of them.  He stated the dilemma is Brevard County is a coastal county; people are going to come here; but the rest of the State is not sharing in the development of those facilities, so the County has a strong argument that more State dollars should be allocated to providing that access instead of the County having to do it all.  He expressed appreciation for the work that was done on the study; and stated there was a fear in the beginning stages that the study would be used to create additional  manatee zones.  He advised in Brevard County if someone wants to get everybody’s back up, the way to do it is to have the fear that it will be used to create additional slow speed or no motor zones; but now the County has a management tool that will allow it to look more holistically at how the waters are used and begin to talk about whether it makes sense to have a manatee protection zone in one area versus having one in another area, so it is great information and he appreciates the effort.  Commissioner Nelson stated this was the first time a year-round study or counts were done; up to that point everything that had been done was seasonal; so they now have some very detailed information and a good start.  He stated the Board should not let it end here because there are other tasks that need to move forward.  He stated with How Shall We Grow? one of the things that struck him from that process is that Brevard County is the beach and the river; people will come to the County; and that needs to be part of the discussion because if another four million people are going to be piled into Central Florida, many will end up in Brevard County.  He stated that needs to be addressed as part of the process; this is the kind of data and detail that is needed to defend ourselves; and inquired if there is anything else that he did not cover.  Mr. Brown stated there is a whole suite of issues such as funding issues, siting of boat ramps properly with good data, and use conflict; and the study gives the data as to where people go, why they go there, and will allow the County to better align its environmental protection practices and policies to minimize conflict and put things in the right place for the right reasons.  He stated it is a great tool to move forward on some very important issues. 

 

Commissioner Voltz stated she is glad Commissioner Nelson brought up How Shall We Grow? because there is probably a meeting coming up; and this would be a great opportunity to bring that information forward because she is sure it has not been done in any of the other areas.  She stated Brevard County is the beach for Orlando and Central Florida; and it is going to be an eye opener for the rest of them there. 

 

Commissioner Bolin requested an explanation of why a location such as Ballard Park, which has 50 spots, is hardly used at all versus another location; and inquired are they so unique that they are not being used to the fullest.  Mr. Brown responded what they have seen is that each location is unique; and a lot of it has to do with destination.  He stated people want to try to launch where it accommodates their destination but also it involves the type of launch; Ballard Park has a very large non-motorized or small sailing vessel usage because of the nature of the park; it has shallow water, which is great for sailing and kayaking; but power boaters who use the ramps most would prefer to go to another location to get to their destination so there are a lot of factors.  He stated the beauty of the data is staff can mine down in there and get into what are the parameters; what the University of Florida has done is given a big picture today; but staff can tease all this data out and say why a ramp is being used in a certain way and how it can be improved to maximize the number of patrons. 

 

Dr. Sidman stated it may be a simple thing that people do not know about the ramps; and if there are people coming in as visitors, they may not have the information on the ramp choices that are available to them in the County.

 

Chairman Scarborough commented on a final report, finding out about individual ramps, mining down the data, and additional information; and inquired if the Board really does not want a final report or is he misinterpreting.  Mr. Brown stated this is the culmination of a study that provides the data.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if this is final or is it the beginning; with Mr. Brown responding it is final in the context that there is no more money; but it is the beginning because now the County has the data to start moving forward, identifying things, and start building on it.  Chairman Scarborough suggested Mr. Brown come back with a scope of service for where to go next; and stated the Board would like to look at that. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to accept the Brevard County Recreational Boating Characterization Study Final Report; and direct staff to prepare a scope of services for where to go next.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated there are people who submitted cards for VIII.B.1, 2, 3, and 4, others only for VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2,  others for VIII.B.1, 2, and 3, and others put individual numbers; his thought is the Board needs to discuss VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2 together because they are part of a Planned Unit Development (PUD); and it is not possible to buy part of a PUD and make it work.  He stated he has also been advised that AG Ventures, which is the subject of VIII.B.1, is going to require an extraordinary vote, so the Board will discuss VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2 first and will handle items VIII.B.3 and VIII.B.4 separately.

 

 

The meeting recessed at 11:14 a.m. and reconvened at 11:34 a.m.

 

Chairman Scarborough reiterated the purchase of the properties that are the subject of VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2, both have to occur because it is zoned as a PUD and it is not possible to buy a portion of that; and the first item will need a vote of four or greater due to the price being agreed to and State law.  He stated the other two items are related but not directly to the purchases. 

 

Environmentally Endangered Lands Manager Mike Knight stated these two acquisitions are very unique; they are talking today about the AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners properties; and displayed a slide showing a map of the area.  He stated the large area bordered in yellow on the left side and the narrow yellow bordered area along the shoreline of the Indian River Lagoon represent the Selection and Management Committee’s highest priority acquisition zones; and those are the areas that have been established by the Committee as having the highest environmental significance in the north end of the County.  He stated there are a number of parcels within the North Indian River Lagoon section that are colored green; there is also the Buck Lake Conservation area on the south end; the large purple border on the left represents property owned by the Miami Corporation; and in Brevard County that represents 10,000 acres of a 47,000-acre ownership between Volusia and Brevard Counties.  He displayed additional slides showing the properties and the area; and stated one of the goals of the Committee is to create an east-west corridor from the North Indian River Lagoon to the southwest down through the lighter purple area where there is a conservation easement that the Committee is exploring with another owner and into the southern end of the Miami corporation property, which borders directly to Buck Lake where there is a significant mitigation bank that is already encumbered to about 400 acres.  He stated the next slide shows the variety of ownership of conservation lands that are located in the County, with the large brown area representing federal ownership, the green areas representing State and local ownership; the large white tract representing the Miami Corporation; two smaller tracts to the east represent the conservation easement that has been discussed and the AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners properties collectively.  He stated this gives a good representative of why the corridor is so important as it comes down from the northeast down into the protected areas that are more along the St. Johns River basin; and there are also two significant mitigation banks, one the Colbert Cameron mitigation bank located to the west of the Miami Corporation property and a mitigation bank on the Miami Corporation property, which is encumbered by about 400 acres.  Mr. Knight stated some of the important environmental aspects of the properties are first that they are identified with funding support as being significant scrub habitat by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and through the Selection and Management Committee process; they represent significant connectivity between the North Indian River Lagoon and the St. Johns River basin; and there is high quality intact habitat structure on the properties and significant existing biological diversity.  He advised the properties are identified by the SMC as the highest priority; the protection of these areas will increase the connectivity between Brevard County, Volusia County, and Seminole County conservation lands, which all have endangered lands programs; and the property also presents opportunities on the north side for potential gopher tortoise relocation in the future.  He stated the size and location of the properties represents a unique opportunity for the EEL Program to management something large, intact, and manageable; having a large boundary makes that a lot easier and more efficient; and it also adds to the future protection of water quality along the North Indian River Lagoon shoreline as it will prevent further development of the area and increased runoff.  He advised it will help to preserve the rural atmosphere in North Brevard; it will create significant opportunities for passive recreation and environmental education; and it will also provide an opportunity to preserve one of the last undisturbed lightscapes in the County.  He displayed a satellite image taken from space of the State of Florida showing the extent of light pollution along the coast of Florida and the inland areas.  He stated along the eastern seaboard of Florida there are very few areas where there are dark spots; and one of the most significant areas is in North Brevard around Mims and Scottsmoor, including the Merritt Island Wildlife Refuge.  He advised studies are currently showing that there are starting to be long-term effects to ecological systems caused by the lack of night; that issue is being looked at by the National Park Service with the Night Sky Team; and they are evaluating all the national parks to determine how those systems are being impacted by artificial light influences from adjacent cities.  He stated they are finding that there are impacts over the long term and not only from an ecological perspective but from a visitor perspective as well; two-thirds of the population of the United States is unable to look up and see the Milky Way from their backyards; that is something he has taken for granted throughout his life and would miss; and it is estimated that by the year 2025 the majority of the United States with be polluted with light and unable to look up and see the Milky Way.  He stated the two properties represented by the triangle on the slide are at the apex of the point where the artificial light disturbance in the Mims-Scottsmoor area starts to die out before it gets up to Edgewater; and one of the reasons that is so important in the corridor that is being proposed is that it stays within the majority of the undisturbed lightscape.  He stated that is a very unique opportunity in Brevard County; and he wanted to make sure the Board was aware of it. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he had a request from Scott Ellis that his presentations on the two appraisals would be best handled separately; both VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2 need to receive a favorable vote or nothing can occur under the law because they are both under the same zoned PUD; and he will go through the cards and then come back to Mr. Ellis because his is a more technical presentation.  He stated if Mr. Ellis wants to address both issues that is fine, or he can reserve the right to come back and talk about VIII.B.2 later. 

 

Dave Breininger stated he is on the EEL’s Selection and Management Committee; he is a wildlife biologist; and he is present to show support for these two pieces of property.  He stated the Committee has done an extensive amount of analysis and spent tens of thousand of hours mapping and in the field studying the biodiversity of Brevard County; and these are very important sites, not only for connectivity but for the scrub landscape that is embedded within the pine flatwoods.  He stated when they look at the sites and their habitat potential, they focus on habitat potential and not the number of animals they see during a site visit; the animals do not line up for them when they want them to when they are looking at prioritization; and commented on methods to do accurate counts.  He stated the other thing is there has been a disruption of natural processes due to habitat fragmentation that occurred 50 years ago, so a lot of populations and unmanaged areas are declining precipitously and it is important to try to bring these areas into conservation.  He stated the EEL Program has recovered populations on areas that were bought in the past; and he thinks they can be very successful in these areas.  He stated the selection of the properties was based a lot on their habitat potential and not whether they have any scrub jays, for example; and they are important from the standpoint of the Scrub Jay Recovery Plan and other Statewide wildlife networks. 

 

Commissioner Scarborough stated there are several members of the Selection and Management Committee present; and thanked them for their hard work and help in making wise decisions. 

 

Mary Sphar, representing Sierra Club, Turtle Coast Group, stated Sierra Club enthusiastically supports acquisition of the AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners properties, which are critically important to preserve the rich biological diversity of Brevard County for future generations.  She stated Sierra Club has been aware of the significance of these particular properties for over two years and has followed with great interest the steps in the progress toward acquisition.  She stated the AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners properties are comprised of a variety of intact natural community types that alternate between wetlands and uplands in a ridge-swale formation; the properties have an intrinsic conservation value due to the quality and variety of their natural communities and the ability to provide needed optimal habitat for various species, notably the Florida Scrub Jay, which is classified as a threatened species under the Endangered Species Act; and the Sierra Club believes the properties are essential for the long-term survival of the Florida Scrub Jay in North Brevard.  She stated besides their intrinsic conservation value, the AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners properties have regional conservation significance as key pieces in a network of public and private lands of very high ecological value; and this habitat network stretches from the Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge on the east to the vast Miami Corporation holdings on the northwest.  She advised the Nature Conservancy has secured a grant of $3 million from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, Florida Scrub Jay Conservation Program toward the purchase of these properties; and Sierra Club urges the Board to vote to acquire these extremely ecologically significant parcels.  She stated the properties are key to achieving the vision of the EEL Program to protect the rich biological diversity of the County for future generations; the Selection and Management Committee considered the properties to be of the highest priority for acquisition; and the Sierra Club is convinced the purchase of the properties is of the greatest importance. 

 

Paul Schmalzer stated he has served on the Selection and Management Committee for the Environmentally Endangered Lands Program since it began in 1990; and he has worked as a plant ecologist in the County for 25 years.  Mr. Schmalzer stated before the Board today are important environmental properties for decisions on acquisition; these are large intact landscapes of high quality natural communities that support important populations of threatened and endangered plant and animal species; and they form a connected landscape, enhancing their environmental value.  He stated the primary goal of the EEL Program, as established by the 1990 referendum and extended by the 2004 referendum, is to protect the biological diversity of the County now and into the future; value for species, natural communities, and landscape connection all factor into the ability to support and maintain biological diversity; and the sites being presented for acquisition today are of very high priority and have the unanimous support of the Committee, which reviewed and approved the general terms of the contracts before they were submitted to the Board.  He stated the region was identified as important early in the EEL Program; he made a site visit to the AG Ventures McIntosh property with the SMC in 1991 and again in 2006; and he also conducted site visits with the SMC to the AG Ventures Saddlebook property in 2006 and to the Scottsmoor Partners property in 2007.  He stated the properties include over 1,500 acres of high quality natural communities, including scrub, mesic and hydric flatwoods, hammocks, hardwoods, swamps, marshes, and pond cypress; and they support existing populations of listed species including the Florida Scrub Jay and gopher tortoise.  He stated the properties are available from willing sellers; the overall purchase price is significantly below the appraised value of the property; and the appraisals were conducted by State-certified appraisers following all EEL Program, Brevard County, and State of Florida requirements and guidelines.  He stated the size, habitat quality, populations of rare plants and animals, and landscape connection make these important acquisitions for the EEL Program; and requested the Board approve the acquisitions today.   

 

Suzanne Valencia thanked the EEL Selection and Management Committee; stated the members have put in thousands of hours of their own time and are all renowned scientists; and they are the dream team.  She stated she is speaking in favor of the acquisition of both properties; and other people are going to speak to the value of the land and why the County needs to preserve it.  She stated at meeting last week, it was stated that the Clerk of Courts should make his objections to the properties known to the EEL Manager ahead of time; and she notices that although the appraisals were out at the beginning of November, Mr. Knight did not get the Clerk’s objections until 5:30 p.m., which meant he had to stay up half the night dealing with those.  She stated that is not fair to the EEL Manager or the Board to have things brought at the very last minute; she imagines the Commissioners have not had a chance to read through the objections; she just got it this morning too; and something ought to change about that. 

 

Chairman Scarborough advised Mr. Hinkle is also a member of the Selection and Management Committee. 

 

Ross Hinkle stated Commissioner Nelson earlier mentioned How Shall We Grow?; and he would like to address the conservation lands in perspective.  He stated he has spent 25 years in Brevard County as an ecologist in natural resources management; he spent a lot of that time on the Environmentally Endangered Lands Selection and Management Committee; like Dr. Schmalzer he is a charter member; and he would like to take the Board back in time a bit to give it the groundwork that the Committee went through to identify some of the large properties that are important.  He noted when the SMC started in 1990-91, it did an ecological triage of the County, looking at the County in terms of what was left and in terms of habitat that would contribute to the goals and missions of conservation and biological diversity protection; and the Committee came up with a plan that included major efforts in the scrub area, the wetlands, along the Indian River Lagoon System, and in the South Beaches and South County scrub acquisitions.  Mr. Hinkle advised this did not come about easily; the Committee spent a long time on it; it had workshops with experts from other areas throughout the State; and it discussed and looked hard at what landscapes would help meet the objectives of the program.  He stated the two areas including Hunters Brooke and others that were recommended in the north part of the County are very critical to the plan; the plan is over 1990 to 2007; and they have been working on this consistently from the beginning.  He stated he thinks of it in terms of how he would get from the St. Johns River basin over to the Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge if he were a black bear; they need to think how this will connect the St. Johns River basin with the Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge and southern Volusia County, which is working hard to preserve areas along the fringes of the Indian River Lagoon; and this is critical to everyone.  He stated this is a very important part of that connectivity; the other thing to look at is the I-95 corridor; there is not much left along the I-95 corridor; and the proposed purchase represents a major landscape that would allow connection across that fragmentation element of the Interstate east and west in Brevard County, which would go a long way to meeting the goals of the Program.  He stated this landscape has characteristics that protect a large number of plants, animals, and ecosystems; the Committee did not recommend this lightly; this is one of the most important acquisitions the Board can make; and requested the Board’s support.  He advised the Board has been very supportive and has listened to the recommendations; the Committee appreciates that; and he appreciates it as a citizen.  He stated he looks forward to completing the northern area acquisition so that there can be the connectivity which the Committee thinks is important in meeting the goals of the EEL Program. 

 

Keith Winsten, representing the Brevard Zoo and the Brevard Nature Alliance, thanked the Board for the great contributions it has made to the folks of the community and to his family personally in the last few weeks by protecting the Thousand Islands, Hunters Brooke, and the other properties that everyone enjoys.  He stated his career has been spent at the intersection of the environment and people; and he wants to bring that perspective to the potential purchases.  He stated he has only been in Brevard County for a few years, but something that brought him to the County originally was the fact that the community twice has overwhelmingly supported the EEL Program, which reflects the wants of the citizens to protect places like the properties being considered.  He stated that is unique; and he does not find that everywhere in this country.  He noted second, the County is rich in wildlife; he visited South Florida many times before moving to the County; he is a birder; and he has spent a lot of time outside looking at birds, but he had never seen a scrub jay and had only seen a gopher tortoise twice in his life.  He stated the first week he was in the County he saw his first scrub jay on Viera Boulevard, right where he lives, because people were smart enough to protect those animals.  He stated he watched a gopher tortoise cross the road in front of him; there were three cars in front of him and he was thinking the animal was going to be hit; but everybody stopped and he watched four teenage girls get out and gently move the tortoise over.  He stated those are the values he wants to raise his family with; and when teenagers are stopping to save a gopher tortoise, then the County is doing something right.  He stated Americans all over the country want to preserve their heritage and values for the next generation; they are proud of the natural resources and want to send them to the next group of folks; in 20 years he has never had a parent say they regretted protecting a piece of land so their children could enjoy it today; but he has seen many times individuals saying they wish they had protected a piece of land because future generations are not going to be able to enjoy it and benefit.  Mr. Winsten stated he hopes the Board takes that perspective as it thinks about this; Brevard County is lucky to have the resources available to protect for the next generation because it is a human issue as well as a wildlife issue; and this is a fantastic opportunity to keep this corridor to be enjoyed for generations. 

 

Carol Hamilton stated she is here to ask for the Board’s support for the AG Ventures property and the Scottsmoor Partners property; they are very important properties individually; but because they are adjoining, it enhances their conservation value for the preservation of threatened and endangered wildlife and for preservation of species habitat.  She requested the Board support and a yes vote.  She stated appraisals will be the big issue in all of this; as a retired realtor, looking at the market today, the housing market is down; it is the law of supply and demand; there are more houses for sale than there are buyers, which brings the values down; however, this does not pertain to land value.  She stated it is not possible to build more land; the land has to be protected because there is not going to be any more of it; and in her experience she has never seen the value of land go down.  She stated larger parcels are always going to retain their value; and requested the Board keep that in mind in considering the purchases.     

 

James Durocher stated he wants to speak about both purchases; and it really boils down to a trust issue.  He stated there are great scientists and biologists working for the County; he trusts their decisions on this; he trusts the EEL’s staff; and he trusts that The Nature Conservancy got the best deal it could on this property.  He stated it is a very important purchase; and he is trusting the Board to make the right decision and preserve the property for Brevard County. 

 

Laurilee Thompson stated they have heard a lot about the value of the properties for the listed and endangered species that are found there, but she lives there and goes by the properties all the time; and she sees the bald eagles and knows that they are there.  She stated there is also huge value in the properties for everyday birds because Brevard County is on the Atlantic flyway; the County is a stopping area for birds that want to get something to eat before continuing their flights to South America; the County is also an important wintering area for regular birds; and commented on participating in migratory bird counts every spring and fall and in the Audubon Christmas count.  She stated North Brevard County consistently has kept the numbers of birds up on these counts because there still are big pieces of property; but sadly on the counts in South and Central Brevard County, the numbers of birds and the numbers of species are going down.  She stated it is important just for the regular everyday birds that the County has these large pieces of property; and there is also the human angle.  She stated this area of North Brevard has been historically a recreational area for people from all over Central Florida; they hunt, fish, ride horses, and ride ATV’s and motorcycles; and these are activities that people have done with their families for generations.  She stated it is her hope that these pieces of property will remain accessible to the public and continue in the role they have played as being important in family activities.  She noted the Rails to Trails corridor runs along the western edge of the AG Ventures property so in addition to the rail corridor there will be this beautiful piece of property that trails can go into from the rail corridor; and this is a hugely important acquisition for the preservation of wildlife as well as the preservation of the quality of life for people in the whole region. 

 

Roy Roberts III stated there was a lot of noise made when this came about by a few people in Scottsmoor; most people supported it; they would like to see the north end of the County remain as it is; and this may or may not be the best way to do it, but it is the only way he knows to do it.  He stated he supports the purchase and thinks the majority of people in Scottsmoor do. 

 

Maureen Rupe, representing the Partnership for a Sustainable Future, urged the Board to buy these lands; and stated they have heard from the experts on the importance of the acquisition of these lands to the environment.  She stated Mr. Knight’s presentation brought a new aspect that she never knew existed, which was concerning the lightscape.  She stated she will research it on the Internet; she has never heard that before; and it sounds fascinating.  She stated scrub jay population is in decline; they are losing the battle; and they need to step up the fight or the scrub jay will face the same fate as the dusky seaside sparrow.  She stated someone emailed her last night to ask if she was aware that species became extinct on a regular basis; she knows this to be correct; but it is nature selecting; and nature does not make mistake, although people do.  She stated people are causing the demise of species through loss of habitat, habitat fragmentation, pesticides, etc.; but the Board has a chance this morning to help nature survive.          

 

Clerk of Courts Scott Ellis stated he will address the AG Ventures property first; Mr. Goodman and Mr. Roper are the appraisers for that property; and he would also like to address the comments of Ms. Valencia and those at the last meeting from Commissioner Voltz.  He stated there have been nothing but consecutive major EEL’s purchases, beginning with the Thousand Islands and Hunters Brooke; with Hunters Brooke they had six days to prepare the report; when the item was tabled, he went back to Hunters Brooke; and during that time, they were given the Scottsmoor Partners property issue.  He stated they were still working on the Hunters Brooke purchase; seven days after a $25 million purchase, the Board is going to make another $25 million purchase; and he has people working right now on Boyd and DiChristopher, which is the salt water marsh that the Board intends to purchase next week.  He stated his question has been from the beginning why these things run so close together and what is the urgency to purchase; and that is why his office is turning in reports at the last minute because that is all the time they have.  He stated Mr. Knight worked last night; but he and his staff also worked last night as well as last weekend and the weekend before that, so he is a little upset about people talking about the reports coming in late because that is all the time they have.  He stated it has never been explained why these items have to be rushed through on seven-day intervals.  He stated on the AG Ventures item, Mr. Roper spoke last week about large parcels; supposedly large parcels are rare and that is why their value has gone up when everything else has bottomed out; that is the supply side; but what was left out was the demand side.  He advised if there is no demand for housing, it does not matter what the supply is for large parcels; the demand for housing right now is virtually zero; and he finds it interesting that the Board was told that the large parcels are going up.  He stated Mr. Roper’s strategy was using individual parcels to show that prices are going up; he carried things upwards into summer of 2006; the market peaked around October 2005; and he agrees the market went up.  He stated all the market went up, but since then all the market has gone down; the appraisals for the AG Ventures property are approximately 18 months old; and the market has dropped dramatically in the past 18 months.  He stated there is a large list of foreclosures in Brevard County; every one of those people wishes they could sell their house for 2005 prices so they would not be getting foreclosed; but the County continues to pay prices from the peak of the market or better than the peak of the market for these properties with no time adjustments downward for old appraisals.  Mr. Ellis advised if the Board will look at the comps that were used, they were adjusted upwards from 2005 to 2006; but there is no evidence that the market went up from 2005 to 2006.  He stated there are old appraisals; they have never been adjusted downwards on these purchases; the AG Ventures property was purchased in 2005 for $3.6 million; and today the County is going to purchase it for $9.2 million, a tripling of the value while the housing market has tanked.  He stated when the properties are appraised it is supposed to be based on market value, which is developable value, not emotional value; and that is what the County is supposed to pay.  He stated there was a comment from Mr. Knight that the auditors are not qualified to appraise the value of land; that is fine and he can agree; but if he has appraisals that do not match, he does not have to be an appraiser to know that they do not match.  He stated he can give a very complex math problem to two Physics PhD’s and if they come up with different answers he knows at least one is wrong, and maybe both are wrong; he has appraisals that say the AG Ventures property is superior to the Scottsmoor property; but today the Board is going to pay more for the Scottsmoor property than for the AG Ventures property.  He stated clearly there is a disconnect between the two appraisals; there is a speed issue again with deadlines; and he would like to remind the Board it is in the same place it was last year.  He stated last November, the Board was trying to run through the AG Ventures item; it was a major rush to push AG Ventures through; and read aloud the comments that were given from The Nature Conservancy, “I am confirming or reminding everyone if this item is not allowed to move forward on the Agenda cycle for our meeting on December 12^th, our meeting will not be necessary since the landowners have previously indicated they must close this year.”  He stated that statement was from December 2006; so when the Board is told there are deadlines, there are no true deadlines; and he does not know why these things are coming up.  He stated he is sorry Ms. Valencia got the report late, but when these things are being rammed through so fast, his staff is being overwhelmed by going through these appraisals.  He stated he fully agrees that the Board will have to buy both of the properties because of the PUD; however, he was given something from Mr. Knight that says that is not a problem because something from Mr. Miller, the appraiser says the PUD can easily be divided.  He stated his belief is it cannot be divided because the west side has a conservation element, water, and sewer.  Chairman Scarborough stated the legal staff and planning staff agree with Mr. Ellis on that issue.  Mr. Ellis stated if that is the case, the properties cannot be appraised as if they have the PUD; they were appraised individually for sale as if they have the PUD; but they must be appraised as if the PUD is vacated and they come in for a rezoning.  He stated the Board was told about the scrub jay habitat, but there are no scrub jays on either of the properties; and he remembers that the Board was told that scrub jays cannot be relocated.  He reiterated there are no birds on the properties; but if there were birds and if there were scrub jay habitat, that should have been in the appraisals because from a development point of view that is a negative and detriment to the value.  He stated if there is significant scrub habitat the appraisals should say that; but the appraisals all say “no significant endangered species.”  He stated they saw one gopher turtle, which is fine; he is not saying one cannot relocate turtles; but the fact is if all these were present, it would detract from the market value of the property, and the Board’s job is to pay the market, not emotional value.  He stated that concludes his comments relating to AG Ventures, but he has other comments on the Scottsmoor Partners property.     

 

Chairman Scarborough stated it would be prudent to call upon Paul Roper and George Goodman; and inquired if Mr. Knight has suggestions on how to proceed.  Mr. Knight stated there is a lot of discussion about when the properties were purchased; they keep hearing they were purchased in 2005; and in this case, it is true that they closed in 2005, but they were placed under Contract in 2003.  

 

Chairman Colon inquired how old are the appraisals; and stated one of the things that she commented on when going through the Hunters Brooke item was that she has an issue with old appraisals.  She stated what staff indicated to her in her office was that everything that the Board was going to receive from there on was going to be appraisals that would be more up-to-date, not 18 months old or anything of that sort.  She inquired how old are each one of the appraisals on these properties.  Mr. Knight responded AG Ventures, as the Clerk pointed out, is about 18 months old; and the Scottsmoor Partners appraisal is much more recent, approximately four months old. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired what role Mr. Roper played in the appraisals.  Paul Roper advised he was one of the appraisers of the AG Ventures property, but had no appraisals work on the Scottsmoor Partners property.  Chairman Scarborough inquired when Mr. Roper completed his work; with Mr. Roper responding the reports are dated June 16, 2006. 

 

Paul Roper stated he is not present to advocate the purchase of the lands or not; they are typical indigenous native vegetation, which happens to be located in the north end of the County; and both parcels are under a PUD Agreement which is many years old and was set that it would be established such that it would not be revoked because a donation was made for a park in that area.  He stated the appraisal reports for AG Ventures were not made contingent upon the continuation of the PUD; in the absence of the PUD, the parcels would be developable at the rate of one unit per acre; and there are 280 acres approved on the westerly side, on the AG Ventures property, which otherwise would be over 500 units if they followed the Agricultural zoning classification.  He stated the PUD does not give any bonus value so he would not expect that its removal or a division of the parcels would make a difference one way or the other.  He stated the Clerk’s Office is right in as much as they have an uncertain period of time subsequent to the appraisals; there have been a lot of foreclosures in the County; they talked about that being predominantly a different classification of properties, being single-family residential and condominiums; and they do not know whether there is any definite regression in terms of values for large-acreage parcels, which are called transitional properties.  He noted there have been some studies done, most recently by the University of Florida, that say that transitional lands within five miles of a city, which would include the Scottsmoor Partners property, probably changed in terms of unit price between 2005 and 2006 between a ratio of 24.3 percent to 50 percent upward; but he does not think there is empirical evidence to conclude with that range, but there have been interviews with participants in transitional type properties throughout the Central Florida area and there is evidence that agricultural land values have dramatically improved and will continue to improve. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if the dates Mr. Roper has are 2002 and 2005; with Mr. Roper responding 2005 and 2006.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if 2005 to 2006 is the change Mr. Roper was looking at; with Mr. Roper responding yes. 

 

Mr. Roper advised he had empirical evidence through a study that he performed on transitional type properties when he appraised a number of ponds for the Florida Department of Transportation in 2004 that indicated that the time of adjustment during that era, between 2004 and January of 2006 would be approximately three percent a month or 36 percent per year.  Mr. Roper advised at that time, in late 2005, the Board of Realtors of Brevard County indicated that the annual rate of appreciation was 40 percent; so there is quite a bit of evidence that would indicate that there has been an extraordinary increase in property values, at least through January 2006.  He stated while they have not got a great deal of evidence on the large land tracts since then, they can only go by published data that would indicate that there is a continuation of price appreciation, although obviously limited, in agricultural properties and perhaps those in transition as well.  He advised they have no empirical evidence to review because there has been a dearth of sales activity in that classification subsequent to January 2006.  He inquired if there are any questions. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Clerk brought up one issue; last week Mr. Roper mentioned that there was an issue of the supply, with condominiums being in larger supply; and therefore there was a disproportionately larger supply than demand.  He stated the point the Clerk made was while they are not producing large tracts, the supply issue has not varied; the demand issue could have slacked because the large tracts are used to create more housing units; and as the need for housing units falls, while the supply may have remained constant, the demand may have fallen.  Mr. Roper stated with regard to the Palm Bay, Melbourne, and Titusville area where the observations are made from the Single-Family Housing Market Study provided by the National Association of Realtors, the 2005 rate of appreciation on housing was 26.7 percent and the rate of appreciation was diminished in those areas to 1.1 percent by this observation, which was the first quarter of 2006; however, for the second quarter of 2006 through the present, the diminished value for the average prices in Palm Bay, Melbourne, and Titusville was down 15 percent, by the published data.  He stated the large land tracts are available as inventory to be taken down by developers when there is a scarcity of housing; they can create housing and provide additional new housing for this absorption; but they do not necessarily know the exact lag time or whether there is a direct relationship between the value of the large agricultural or transitional tracts of land and the housing price, median income, or median price for housing in Brevard County.  He stated it could be expected that if the decline continues much like they are observing in the second quarter of 2007, they would likely see land values diminish in terms of value for those lands that would provide future housing that did not have alternative uses or a continued agricultural use until such time as the properties are available for housing development.  He stated he does not expect that the land values that were provided in the summer of 2006 for AG Ventures have declined; however, he would be more than happy to measure that; but there is not enough data out there to find out whether it has diminished.  He stated they certainly know it is not in relationship to the diminished housing values they find in the three cities he cited.              

 

George Goodman of George Goodman Consulting, stated Mr. Roper did such a great job that he is not sure he can add much.  He stated he will address the one question on the supply and demand issue; one thing they have noticed throughout Florida is that large tracts of land do not necessarily sell to developers; a lot of investors have recognized the inherent value of land, particularly in areas that are rural in nature but close to metropolitan areas with future potential for development; if the land was developable today and there was enough demand to develop it, the property would not be worth the price that he appraised it for, but would probably be worth three or four times the appraisal amount; so the appraisals represent the state of the land today, not an imminent development stage.  He stated some land in the most rural counties in the State, from the period of 2002 through 2005, saw unprecedented increases in value; counties such as Henry County or Glades County had virtually no demand for residential housing, but the prices of the land doubled and tripled in two to three-year period.  Mr. Goodman stated they do not have enough recent sales of large tracts of land to measure what has happened since January 2006; but there is enough evidence available to show that there was a tremendous increase in land values over the period from 2004 and 2005, up to the beginning of 2006; and the date of the valuation in the appraisals was April 2006, so there was no an opportunity to have any sales to indicate any difference. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired which property Mr. Goodman appraised; with Mr. Goodman responding the same one that Mr. Roper did, the AG Ventures properties, which included the McIntosh property and the Saddlebrook property.

 

Commissioner Colon inquired if Mr. Goodman said he originally looked at the property in January 2006; with Mr. Goodman advising it was April 2006.  Commissioner Colon inquired if he started in January and finished by April; with Mr. Goodman responding no.  Mr. Goodman advised all the evidence they had from published reports, brokers, etc. was that the prices increased through or up to January 2006; and the date of valuation of the properties is April 2006.  Commissioner Colon stated that is a long time ago; with Mr. Goodman conceding it is.  Commissioner Colon stated that is 18 months ago; and inquired if Mr. Goodman would buy a house now at a price from April 2006; with Mr. Goodman responding a house and large tracts of land are two different things.  Commissioner Colon stated there was a comment made that land does not go down; and inquired if Mr. Goodman would say as an appraiser that land does not go down in price.  Mr. Goodman responded no, he could not say that land does not go down in price, but it does not go down in price like residential housing.  Commissioner Colon stated in this community she has seen that.  Mr. Goodman inquired what Commissioner Colon saw; with Commissioner Colon responding land go down as fast as the homes have gone down.  Mr. Goodman stated there have not been enough sales of large tracts of land anywhere that he knows of to show that.  Commissioner Colon stated therefore one would leave it alone and everyone’s prices around you would be going down.  Mr. Goodman stated he does not know what Commissioner Colon means.  Commissioner Colon inquired if  that is the case, why do they have folks to appraise it if they are just dealing with the same data coming back time and time again; what the appraisers are saying is they do not have anything to compare to; and at that point it is frustrating for the elected officials.  She inquired why does the Board have appraisers if all they keep hearing is that there is no other larger tract to compare the properties with.  Mr. Goodman stated Commissioner Colon is talking about apples and oranges; they are talking about tracts of land to determine where land values have gone in the recent past; an appraisal is a snapshot of a value of a property as of a specific date; and they have no idea what will happen after that date.  Commissioner Colon stated even if the Board hired other appraisers to give an appraisal of these properties, all the Board is going to hear is that they do not have anything to compare the properties with; if the Board asked someone to appraise the properties again, it likely would be January 2008, almost two years after Mr. Goodman’s appraisal; and inquired if it would behoove the Board to get an appraisal that would be up to date with the January 2008 prices versus those of spring 2006.  Mr. Goodman responded if that is what the Board wants, it can get a current estimate of value. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he told Mr. Ellis that he could come back to talk on item VIII.B.2; however, an affirmative vote is needed on both VIII.B.1 and VIII.B.2 and that B.1 will require an extraordinary vote; so if there are not at least four votes for VIII.B.1, it is irrelevant to talk about VIII.B.2.  He inquired where is the Board going with this. 

 

Commissioner Voltz stated the Board received information from Mr. Knight in response to the Clerk’s issues; and she supports the purchase. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated obviously they get an appraisal and then they begin negotiations; and inquired when did the negotiations begin and when was the Contract signed for the option.  Mr. Knight responded he does not have the exact dates in front of him; the last step was approval of the contracts by the Selection and Management Committee on September 28, 2007; and at that meeting it was noted that they were going to be coming to the meeting on October 23, 2007.  Commissioner Nelson inquired if much of the work was actually done earlier than that; with Mr. Knight responding that is correct.

 

Commissioner Bolin stated she does not want to rush into this if there is a possibility that the new appraisal, which she would like to suggest, could show something different; if it comes back the same, then she will feel very solid about it; but she is not comfortable at this point in time and would propose another appraisal on the property. 

 

County Attorney Scott Knox stated if the Board is going to seek additional appraisal work, it just needs to get an update on the existing appraisals if it wants to use the current appraisers; and that would be easier for them to do than to start all over from scratch.

 

Commissioner Nelson stated that may put the Board in a position where it will have a seller who says it does not matter; there is always a possibility that they may not choose to sell to the Board at that point; and the Board should understand that is also part of the dynamics.  He stated the Board could end up with an appraisal that drops a few hundred dollars and then have an unwilling seller; and inquired when the contract runs out.  Mr. Knight responded if the contract is not exercised today, it will run out today; and it is important that the Board understand that there is a significant discount on the Scottsmoor Partners property, which is $5 million below appraised value. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated she understands and appreciates that; and inquired if the Board did go forward do an update, what is the time element for an update on the appraisal.  Mr. Knight responded it would likely be two to three weeks, and maybe longer considering the holidays.   

 

Commissioner Colon stated the Board needs to set some kind of policy that appraisals should not be coming back to the Board, especially with the current market, that are more than six months old; that is why she was uncomfortable going with the decision at the last meeting; and if the Board is comfortable now, it will be comfortable four or five weeks from now.  She stated every time the Board hears there is a rush; the last time the Board heard they wanted to close in December 2006; so it would behoove the Board to make sure.  She stated she is supportive of the project; it is 100% the right thing to do; and the City of Titusville and community support it.  She stated the Board needs to be very transparent and accountable; it needs to send that message loud and clear; if it goes out, comes back in December 2007 or January 2008, and the

numbers are right in line, the people who are selling it should not be afraid of any appraisal coming back and should be comfortable that they are giving the Board a good deal.  Commissioner Colon stated it should not worry the owners; and that is where the Board is having difficulty.  She stated it was the same thing with the Thousand Islands; she was very supportive of the project; she has been supportive of all the EEL’s project; but it is the procedure and the way the Board is going about doing it.  She stated there are all these urgencies; that is where they do not see eye to eye; and it keeps happening time and time again.  She reiterated she is supportive of the project for all the reasons that people stated today; but like Commissioner Bolin said, if the price comes back and it is still showing that not much has happened from there to here, then the Board will be able to respect that; but that is where it is having this discussion.  She stated she was feeling comfortable before because she was told in her office very clearly that the Board would never have to deal with the dilemma again of an appraisal being a year or a year and a half old and that appraisals would be six to eight months old at the most.  She stated if everyone is comfortable with this transaction, they will be comfortable with it a month from now; and she will stand behind what she said.

 

Commissioner Voltz inquired if the appraisers were to go back out and reevaluate the appraisal, what do they see as being different.  Mr. Roper responded over the past several months he researched similar property classifications at this location and elsewhere along the St. Johns River, and is currently working elsewhere in Brevard County; and nothing he has discovered indicates that there has been any regression in the unit values in the large acreage parcels.  He stated he has been appraising these land classifications for 33 years; he does not recall ever having a situation on a large land tract unless it was almost predominantly agricultural versus transition where he would make a negative adjustment; and that does not mean that somebody else would or could; but he is not sure he could prove it one way or the other.  He stated in the absence of that type of proof, he would suggest the values would probably remain constant until the next big move up.  Mr. Goodman stated a lot of the big properties are bought by investors rather than end users; when they get into a period like this, the only people who sell the properties are people who do not have enough money to carry the properties and so they sell them; and basically they are liquidation type sales.  He stated any investors who own these properties now who have deep enough pockets to carry them will not sell them unless someone offers them their price; he agrees with Mr. Roper; and he has been doing this since 1972.  He stated Commissioner Colon said she has seen land values go down; a lot of times residential lot values will go down; in his subdivision residential lot values are down; but he still sees land sales not showing any decrease in value. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated if the Board is going to go out for appraisals, it should not ask either Mr. Roper or Mr. Goodman to be part of that; it would have to be somebody from outside to give a third opinion; and inquired what good it does to go back to the same folks.  She stated she did not realize that when they did the last one, it was more along the lines of making sure; the community sees the value of property going down and that the appraisals are not recent; and Mr. Goodman and Mr. Roper do not have to answer to the citizens, but the Board does, so that is why it is difficult for the board to be able to work with something that is not fresh.  She stated it is a huge dilemma; no matter how much the Board supports a project, it has to justify it; and she would not want to put the current folks in that position so the appraisals would have to go to somebody else to appraise these properties.  She stated at that point if whoever the Board chooses to do that comes back and says they agree with Mr. Roper and Mr. Goodman’s appraisal, the Board will be accountable and transparent to the citizens.  Commissioner Colon stated that is where this issue has become a little more difficult; and commented on the project, what it stands for, and what it is going to do to the community.  She stated Brevard County is known for the protection of the environment; it takes great pride in that; but in the 18 years she has lived in Brevard County, she has never seen this kind of bubble either so she cannot reference what happened in another year.  She stated it is difficult for everyone because appraisals are difficult; but as elected officials the Commissioners have to at least be able to justify to the citizens; and she believes the community supports these purchases. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated he feels bad for the appraisers; the Board asked them to do an appraisal in 2006; and that was then used as the basis for negotiation; but now the Board is saying it is 2007 and the appraisers were wrong.  Commissioner Colon stated the Board did not say that.  Commissioner Nelson stated the Board is saying it is ready to go back to get additional appraisals and does not trust Mr. Roper or Mr. Goodman to update their appraisals; and that is kind of a disservice because the appraisers did what they were asked to do and were out of it at that point.  He stated the Board has dragged its feet because it came back last year and the issue was the PUD and could it be separated; it was about price; so it was extended.  He stated the Board was okay with the price, but it was extended, so delays were created.  He stated if there is any failure, it is a failure of the County’s policies to address this kind of issue; if he was a landowner, he would not negotiate with the County because it drags things out; and at some point it is going to say to the owners that the Board thinks their land is worth less, but it did not think that a year ago when the price was negotiated.  He inquired what landowner would deal with the County because one never knows when the County is actually going to move forward with an acquisition; stated it is a terrible precedent to set; and the Board is doing a disservice to the appraisers because their number was good as of the date they gave it to the Board.  He stated now a year later the Board is asking them to be accountable for a number that they would have had to have a crystal ball to reach; and that is not how appraising works, so he would move forward with the acquisition.  He stated this is a critical piece of property; he does not think the Board is going to resolve the issue; and the appraisers have stuck their necks out to say they do not believe the prices for land have backed up.  He stated the Board is dealing with investors as opposed to a developer who is ready to develop; there is no market for that; but an investor is looking at it long term and will hold the property until the price comes back; and the County will have lost.  He stated he is ready to move forward with it.  

 

Commissioner Bolin inquired if even if the appraisers went out and reevaluated, do they feel strongly that they would be coming back with the same appraisal.  Mr. Goodman responded he would never say that without doing the work first; and all they can do is address the broader issue of land values as to what they have seen.  Commissioner Bolin stated Commissioner Nelson had a good point in that the appraisers did their work; they did exactly what the Board wanted them to do; and the figures are of that date.  Mr. Goodman advised the figures are as of April 2006. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if Mr. Roper wants to respond.  Mr. Roper stated he sees no need for additional analysis on the land parcels as to the time adjustment; there is an extremely long lag period between any drop in values on these land parcels when compared to individual single-family units, townhomes, condominium units, and so forth; he does not expect to find any
problems; and most of the indicators that he gets from published resources indicate that this land classification has not regressed.  Mr. Roper advised it is up to the Board; and if the Board wants them to take another look, they will be glad to do so, or they will step aside ad have somebody else look at it.

 

Commissioner Colon stated the appraisers did their job in 2006 and did it well; that is the appraisal the Board received; but whoever’s fault it is, they are in the fall of 2007.  She stated therefore the issue is not to question the credibility of the appraisers; but she would like to make sure there is a more recent appraisal.  She stated an appraisal that is 18 months old is not acceptable; and that is all she is saying.  She stated the Board has put the appraisers on the spot; she was not intending to do that at all because it would be very inappropriate; and therefore the Board should get a different appraiser from the outside to come in, look at the properties, and give an appraisal as soon as possible.  She stated she is all for speeding this up; and if they are able to have it back by the beginning of January, by all means they should do it.  She stated she does not think any Commissioner would be uncomfortable with that. 

 

Commissioner Voltz inquired how long it took to do the original appraisal; with Mr. Roper responding the usual timeframe is three to four months, and they have work in progress and other assignments.  Mr. Roper advised they usually ask for 90 days; sometimes they reduce it to 60 days; and he does not know about Mr. Goodman.  Mr. Goodman stated it took approximately 60 days for the current appraisal because the date of the inspection was April 2006 and the date of the report was June 2006.  Commissioner Voltz stated it takes two to four months.  Mr. Goodman stated that is just for the appraisal, not for the review; and after the appraisal is done, it has to go to the review appraiser.  Mr. Roper stated it is usually 30 days.  Mr. Goodman stated it is three to four weeks to do the review, so the Board is probably talking about three months.  Commissioner Voltz stated it would be three to five months; and inquired how much would it cost to do a brand new appraisal.  Mr. Knight advised in the Hunters Brooke situation, the cost to do the original appraisals ended up costing more than the first time; and the first time it was under $12,000 but it was $20,000 to do it a second time.  Commissioner Voltz inquired about the cost for a brand new appraisal from start to finish; with Mr. Knight responding looking at historical costs, it would be anywhere from $12,000 to $20,000 to have the appraisals redone.  

 

Commissioner Colon inquired if the Board gave the appraisers the same task and they already did all the research and have all the data, how long would it take them to reevaluate what they already have.  She advised she is not saying she would do that as she said it needs to be somebody else; but there is no way it would take four months when they already have all the data.  Mr. Goodman stated he did not say it would take four months; and he was talking about the whole process.  He stated Mr. Roper is probably busier than he is because he is with a larger firm; but just with the work that he and his associate have going on, they probably could not finish the appraisal update until the end of the year.  Commissioner Colon stated by January they should be able to bring it back; with Mr. Goodman agreeing that sometime around the first week of January they probably could finish the update and then it would have to go to a reviewer, which would probably take until February.  Commissioner Colon inquired how it would be different from anybody else who would review that information; with Mr. Goodman responding he does not know what Commissioner Colon means.  Commissioner Colon stated the question was asked how long it would take from scratch; but this is not from scratch; all the data is there; and that is why she has to make sure she is asking the right question.  Commissioner Colon stated the right question is if the Board was to give the appraisers this information and say it needed them to reevaluate the appraisal, would they say it would be January; they are already at the end of November so it would take about six weeks; and advised there is a big difference between six weeks and four months.  Mr. Goodman stated they would have to start from scratch, get all the information, and redo the whole thing.  Commissioner Colon stated they already have all that data; and inquired why someone would have to start from scratch.  Mr. Goodman stated no appraiser would take that information without verifying it themselves.  Commissioner Colon stated the Board would hope they would verify; and that is what she was trying to base it on.  She stated the Board was going to have a workshop strictly about appraisals because the Board was trying to get it down to a science; the Board does not only deal with EEL’s but with roads and acquisition of land on a regular basis; and the Board was uncomfortable even before EEL’s came into the picture with regards to how it was getting the kind of appraisals it was getting back.  She stated the Board was going to have a workshop on that issue in two weeks, which had to be rescheduled; she guesses that is where the frustration comes in; inquired does someone have to start from scratch or because all the data is already there do they not have to start from scratch; and advised that is what the Board is trying to understand. 

 

Commissioner Bolin thanked the appraisers for the information; stated this is an important purchase; she has been listening to everything; and she does not know if she wants to risk starting with a brand new appraiser because of the time element.  She stated Mr. Goodman said if the Board decided to task him with an update on the appraisal that it would be a shorter timeframe.  Mr. Goodman stated he was speaking for himself, but does not speak for Mr. Roper.  Mr. Roper stated it would definitely be a shorter timeframe.  Commissioner Bolin stated the appraisal as it stands now, even though it is 18 months old, still has the selling price quite a bit under it.  Mr. Roper advised Mr. Knight will have to speak to that.  Mr. Knight advised he would like to have Mr. Fountain respond to that.

 

Keith Fountain of The Nature Conservancy stated in this particular transaction that they appraised the County probably got a discount of $60,000 or so; Scottsmoor Partners is the transaction that has the largest discount; and he will speak briefly to the order of vents because it is important for the Board to consider.  He stated when the property was appraised, they made their inspection in April 2006; at that time the AG Ventures landowner came forward and signed the willing seller application; and the appraisers completed their product in June 2006.  He stated knowing the process, the review was probably done in July or August 2006; and The Nature Conservancy commenced negotiations with the party and reached an agreement towards the end of 2006 and tried to bring the contract forward; but because of the PUD, there was a decision to put that transaction aside at that time.  He advised since that time, they stepped up efforts with Scottsmoor Partners to get a willing seller application signed, which was eventually done; and they entered into the appraisal process for that property, all the while making phone calls to AG Ventures to try to get them to be patient because at that point they were very disappointed and were also beginning to lose money.  He stated they moved forward; the Scottsmoor Partners negotiations probably strung out over two months or so; eventually it was under contract; and they then went back to AG Ventures, which had an interest in seeing the property in conservation after they spoke to them of the goals of the EEL program in North Brevard and a contract was signed.  He stated that is where they stand today; today the Board has a constraint in both contracts that the contracts be assigned to the County and the option agreements be assigned no later than today, which is a bit of an atypical contract requirement, but one that has been brought on by the stagnation in the process that they are seeing because everything is being audited and things are being deferred.  Mr. Fountain stated landowners are seeing that; they are reluctant to get into a contract with the County because they do not know when they are going to pop out of the end of the tunnel; and the option agreements that they enter into with the landowners are self-extending until essentially they get to the Board, because if the Board accepts assignment of the option agreement, it would then have 75 days in which to exercise that option, so that is one time constraint.  He stated during that period of time the contract is not binding on the Board; it is binding on the landowner to sell; and if the Board wants the appraisers to go back out and look at the data, it has that opportunity as a part of the transaction due diligence.  He commented on getting a survey, getting an environmental assessment, and title commitment; and advised the Board has that opportunity but it is important to note that if the Board does not accept at least assignment of the option agreement today, then both of the contracts will lapse on their phase.

 

Commissioner Voltz thanked Mr. Fountain for the information; and stated it was eye opening.  She stated the reason she asked the question earlier about how long it would take is because someone was saying the appraisers would need to start from scratch and the current appraisers would not be involved.  She stated what the appraisers have done already and the statements they have made about the possibility of it not really changing all that much means the Board will be paying additional money and not getting a whole lot of difference in value of the land; there is a possibility of not being able to purchase it at all; and at this point the best thing to do is move forward with the purchase of the property. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated Commissioner Voltz said “purchase the property” but Mr. Fountain just indicated the Board is in the posture of having an option and can decide in 75 days whether it can actually go ahead to close.  He inquired if he understood correctly; with Mr. Fountain responding yes, the option period is 75 days.  Mr. Fountain advised there is a provision in one of the contracts, because of the delay in getting to where it is today, that says if it does not close before January 28^th or something like that, then one of the sellers has the opportunity to walk away from the deal.  Chairman Scarborough stated the option is totally the Board’s; if it moves in that direction it would  have the ability to get more validation of current values; and there are still some Commissioners who are concerned about values so they would have an opportunity satisfy themselves before the closing.  Mr. Fountain stated that is correct; if the Board moves forward today it is not binding on the Board to actually appear at the closing table and write the check for these properties; and the Board has a period of time, probably only 30 to 45 days, to really take a look at this.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if the Board can get the dates when one of the purchasers can walk away; with Mr. Fountain responding it is January 31, 2008.  Chairman Scarborough stated that is pretty good. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated this is classic; the Board spent the last four years chasing appraisals upwards; now it is chasing them downwards; and it is a kind of irony that one day in 2009, the Board is going to be able to buy property because at that point it will be right.  He stated it is difficult; the process is dynamic; it is moving all the time; and he is comfortable moving forward because even if the appraisal came down to $1,000 an acre, it is still such an  important piece of property to the EEL Program that he would still support its acquisition.  He stated he is not sure what the adjusted appraisal is going to do except put the Board back in the same position at a later date.  Commissioner Nelson stated the question at this point is whether the Board supports this as being property that the EEL Program should be acquiring based on all the characteristics that it heard from the Selection and Management Committee; and there may be some movement one way or the other in the pricing, but that does not change the overall need to acquire the property.                                              

 

Commissioner Bolin thanked Mr. Fountain for providing information; and stated it appeased a lot in her mind.

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to approve moving forward with the purchase of the AG Ventures, LLC and Honeybrook Development Corporation properties.   

 

 

Chairman Scarborough requested Commissioner Bolin rephrase the motion and rather than the word “purchase” use the term “move forward with the assignment of the option”; and inquired if that is okay; with Commissioner Bolin responding yes.

 

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to move forward with the Assignment of Option to Purchase AG Ventures, LLC and Honeybrook Development Corporation properties.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Board still has the Scottsmoor Partners property.  Mr. Ellis advised the Board did not answer the first one.  Chairman Scarborough stated the Board moved on the AG Ventures item and is now going to Item VIII.B.2.

 

Scott Ellis inquired what the Board moved to do; the Agenda Report says the Board takes the Option and staff executes the Contract; but there was nothing in the motion that says the item comes back to the Board to make the purchase.

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if was the intention of Commissioner Bolin’s motion that they not close on the property until it comes back to the Board with additional appraisal information; with Commissioner Bolin responding that is correct.  Chairman Scarborough inquired was that the intention of the seconder; with Commissioner Voltz indicating it was.  Chairman Scarborough stated that was the way he voted on the issue; and inquired if anyone disagrees, with no objections being heard.  County Manager Peggy Busacca inquired if the Board means for the current appraisals to be updated; with Chairman Scarborough responding yes.  Chairman Scarborough stated it is his understanding the Board has until January 31, 2008; before that date the items would be put on the Agenda again so the Board can move from just the assignment of the option to exercising it; and inquired if that is correct; with Mr. Fountain responding yes. 

 

Mr. Ellis inquired if it is correct that as the option is assigned, the County is under no obligation to make the purchase; with Chairman Scarborough responding that is what he understood Mr. Fountain to say.  Mr. Fountain advised that is correct, but the Board should have Mr. Knox confirm that. 

 

Mr. Knox stated he thinks it is right; the option may be exercised during the period beginning with the purchaser’s execution of the agreement ending 75 days after the assignment of the agreement to the Board of County Commissioners; today would be the event of assignment; and the Board would have 75 days from now to exercise it. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated rather than it being a staff function, Commissioner Bolin’s motion was that it would come back before the Board with additional appraisal information; and at that moment the Board will actually decide whether to exercise it or not.  He inquired if that was the intent; with Commissioner Bolin responding that was the intent. 

 

Mr. Fountain stated if the Board looks at the AG Ventures contract, in paragraph 13, there is a provision whereby AG Ventures can walk away from the transaction if it has not closed by January 31, 2008, which is not consistent with the 75-day option. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if the Board wants to ask the current appraisers to update their appraisals or get a third or two more independent appraisals.  He stated it was his understanding that they were asking for updates because of the time constraints; and requested a motion to that effect for the record.

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to direct that updates to the two appraisals of the AG Ventures, LLC and Honeybrook Development Corporation properties be obtained from the original appraisers.  Motion carried and ordered; Commissioner Colon voted nay. 

 

 

Commissioner Colon stated she is voting nay because she thinks they should get someone from the outside. 

 

Mr. Ellis stated unfulfilled contracts happen all the time; there was one with Scottsmoor Partners that was an unfulfilled contract that was entered into here; that is simply part of buying and selling property; and whether people sell or not to the County, they are certainly selling based on what they think they are getting as value for their property.  He stated he does not disagree with Mr. Roper or Mr. Goodman; there was a dramatic run up in prices through 2005; but his point is still that the properties here were purchased at the peak of the run up, and yet the County is now paying two to three times what they were bought for at that peak.  He stated one of the properties had a mortgage which certainly meant it had an appraisal; he would think that each had appraisals; and what the Board is dealing with is not peak of the market price, but two and three times the peak of the market price that the properties were purchased for.  He stated he does not think the PUD has been properly addressed in all four appraisals; Mr. Miller’s appraisal in Scottsmoor said that the PUD could be split; but that is not the information the Board has from County staff, which is that the PUD could not be broken in half as there are critical parts of the project on each side of the PUD.  He stated on Scottsmoor Partners, achieving the density they desire is based on having water and sewer service based on a package plant and water plant on the west side of I-95; and if those facilities are not there, then they would have to go back on the PUD, vacate on the east side, and come in for rezoning.  Mr. Ellis stated he can remember times when people would come before the Board and vacate PUD’s and come back for a rezoning; so what Mr. Miller said was an extraordinary assumption on the density of the PUD.  He stated it is more than an extraordinary assumption in that one cannot assume the density on the Planned Unit Development; it is impossible to do; neither are stand alone parcels; and it should have been reflected in the appraisal for value.  He stated on the rest of the issues, they still deal with the Scottsmoor Partners at triple what they paid; the Board has been told that it is endangered land; but it is pretty much used for pasture and was burned heavily in 1998 during the fires.  He noted the appraisals did not find endangered species on the property; the program is called Environmentally Endangered Lands, not vacant lands; and what the Board is looking at buying on the Scottsmoor property is simply vacant land.  He stated Mr. Knight discussed the wildlife corridor; but the problem with the wildlife corridor is I-95; and he is not sure exactly what critter is going to make it from the St. Johns River basin to the Indian River and back and get through I-95.  He stated the fact is it is not possible to have a wildlife corridor in that area; he is not sure why the County is looking at the Scottsmoor Partners property other than the issue with the PUD and AG Ventures property because there is nothing on the Scottsmoor Partners property that identifies it as endangered property.  He stated the property is pine and flatwood, which is fundamentally the most common type of property in the State; there are no endangered species that have been identified there; and if there were they would have been identified in the appraisal and the appraisal would have to be lowered on the value because it would have lowered the development value.  He requested the Board, when it comes back at the end of the timeframe, discuss both parcels at that time.  He noted the Board has a motion right now to accept the option on the AG Ventures property.      

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he does not know what the motion will be; but he assumes it would be the same, to accept the assignment of the option, the appraisals be updated, and then it would be on the Agenda before going to closing. 

 

Mr. Ellis stated what Mr. Roper and Mr. Goodman said is critical when they talk about not knowing if the property is going up or down; and there are no comparable sales in any of these things from 2006 and 2007.

 

Chairman Scarborough advised the Board will need to take a break so Space Coast Government Television can make a technical adjustment.

 

The meeting recessed at 1:15 p.m. and reconvened at 1:19 p.m.

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if the Board would not want to proceed with items VIII.B.3 or VIII.B.4 at this time unless they are done contingent upon subsequent action.  Mr. Knight advised that is a procedural question.  Chairman Scarborough stated the Board will come back to the issue. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to move forward with the Assignment of Option to Purchase Scottsmoor Partners property, with the stipulation the Option for Sale and Purchase must come back to the Board with additional information for
consideration and approval before it can be exercised.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated as far as updates on the appraisals, Commissioner Colon has a different opinion on it; and he would like a separate motion.

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to direct that updates to the two appraisals of the Scottsmoor Partners property be obtained from the original appraisers. 

 

 

Commissioner Nelson inquired if those were reviewed by the review appraiser previously; with Mr. Knight responding yes.  Commissioner Nelson inquired if the Board is going to have them updated and have reviews done because he does not know if that was clear on the previous one.  Chairman Scarborough stated it was not.  Mr. Knight stated that can be done if the Board likes.  Commissioner Nelson stated that is going to make it tight; with Mr. Knight advising it ties the time down significantly.  Commissioner Voltz stated if it comes back significantly different, then it would need a third party review, but if it does not come back any different, then there is no reason to have a third party.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if that is okay; with Commissioner Nelson responding yes.     

 

Chairman Scarborough called for a vote on the motion.  Motion carried and ordered; Commissioner Colon voted nay. 

 

 

Mr. Knight stated it would be best to move forward to review the two issues; if the properties are not purchased, then they will become null and void; but they would be two things the Board would not have to worry about later. 

 

 

Clerk of Courts Scott Ellis stated he does not know how the Board can address item VIII.B.3 at this point. 

 

Keith Fountain of The Nature Conservancy stated this is the grant from The Nature Conservancy pursuant to the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service; the grant requires that the money be contributed at closing; so the Board can consider it today and if there is no closing, obviously the money would not go toward the purchase of the property. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the motion will be to accept the grant contingent upon the purchase.

 

Mr. Ellis stated his understanding is this is the Scrub Jay Conservation Fund; with Mr. Fountain advising that is correct.  Mr. Ellis stated people pay into this when they mitigate for takings of scrub jay or scrub jay habitat; with Mr. Fountain advising this is one of the options available to mitigants who take habitat.  Mr. Ellis stated things have obviously changed in the last 15 years on scrub jays; and inquired how is the County eligible for a grant when the property has no birds.  Mr. Fountain stated he does not know that a formal census has been done of the property to determine whether jays exist or not; but the effect of the MOU is to carry out the intent of the Scrub Jay Recovery Plan, noting he is not an expert on this.  He stated he does not believe it has been formally adopted; but it was a Recovery Plan for the species put together by a Statewide panel of experts; and there are a number of metapopulations of jays around the State that are targeted by the Plan.  He stated this is the first time that money will be spent or granted out of the MOU by The Nature Conservancy; and one of the conditions that was imposed by U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service was to look at the top five metapopulations ranked for recovery by the Plan.  He stated the North Brevard population happens to be number one; and of the top five, it is easily the best place to spend the money to protect jays on a large landscape scale basis.  He stated what the Plan attempts to do is protect large contiguous landscapes of potential high-quality jay habitat; even if there are some areas that are not occupied right now, with proper management eventually the population may flourish, increase, and occupy those portions of the property.  He stated the property does qualify and has been approved for this acquisition by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. 

 

Mr. Ellis stated he checked with Natural Resources; there are no jay families in the immediate area; and they were told previously that one could not relocate the birds and that they had a limited range in which they would move.  He stated this is going back to scrub jay issues the Board dealt with ten or more years ago; and expressed concern at taking a $3 million grant for scrub jay habitat when there are no scrub jays anywhere in the area.      

 

Commissioner Nelson stated the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service is saying it qualifies; there are scrub jays offsite; and historically they move through a range.  He stated they have focused down to twenty-five acres; it is necessary to have that much; and they are talking about encouraging a larger population over a larger area. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Nelson, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to execute Standard Grant Contract with The Nature Conservancy, and authorize the County Manager to execute any other standard documents and amendments required by The Nature Conservancy for the acceptance of grant funds for the acquisition of Scottsmoor Partners, LLC, Ag Ventures LLC, and Honeybrook Development Corporation properties.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously.    

 

 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated the Lease can be done contingent upon actually purchasing the property; with EEL Manager Mike Knight advising that is staff’s understanding. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Nelson, seconded by Commissioner Voltz, to adopt Resolution and approve a Cattle Lease on a 112-acre portion of the Scottsmoor Partners, LLC property, contingent upon the County exercising the option to purchase the 852-acre tract.  Motion carried

and ordered unanimously. 

 

 

Commissioner Colon inquired if the purchases all go through, how much EEL money will be left and can they bond out another $15 million.  Mr. Knight stated including these deals and the other deals the Board has approved, but excluding the Boyd and DiChristopher parcels, which are coming before the Board next week representing approximately $3 million, there should be approximately $4 to $5 million left; but he would have to check the numbers to be sure.  He stated then there is the 2004 referendum; they have only bonded out for approximately $45 million of the $60 million that was approved, so that would be an additional $15 million that could potentially be bonded out, assuming the tax base would support it; and staff will have to investigate it.  Commissioner Colon inquired what Mr. Knight means about the tax base supporting it; and stated that was what was voted on and the citizens expect it to be $60 million.  Mr. Knight stated that is correct; he is not an expert on bonding; but his understanding is that the Bond Counsel would look at it and decide whether the Board would be able to bond the full $15 million.  

 

Commissioner Nelson stated he and Mr. Fountain were talking during the break about market conditions; and requested Mr. Fountain share some of that information.

 

Keith Fountain with The Nature Conservancy stated one of the things that may have created that misperception is that the appraisals are significantly exceeding prices that are at the top of the market prices; and it is important to note that both for AG Ventures and Scottsmoor Partners, they contracted to buy all or portions of these properties as early as 2003.  He stated their contract price was established during a period that was easily the first half of what was a meteoric real estate market; so there was significant appreciation in the properties between their entering into a contract and when they actually closed; in some cases they closed when the market was still going; and it is important to understand the acceleration or pace of appreciation the market had.  He stated Mr. Roper referred to a study and there was some period of appreciation of 48 percent; and he would like to tell the Board a story of what happened to The Nature Conservancy where it came in second on an auction.  He stated it was a couple of years ago in Central Florida; a real estate broker who was as experienced as anybody in the State in the sale of large tracts of land called The Nature Conservancy in June of that year and advised a property was going to be up for auction and not to be surprised if it sold for $3,000 an acre; the property was 25,000 acres; but when the auction was finished and the property went to contract in October or November, it was $5,000 an acre.  He stated that is the way the real estate market was going; The Nature Conservancy does a lot of work around the State; he is constantly polling appraisers on what the real estate market is doing; and he is getting the same answers from all of them that there is not a lot of activity.  He stated his fear is always that the activity that is occurring is the people who are distressed; they bought in a market environment when people were buying expecting the sell that property six months later and make a 50 percent profit; but the market came to a screeching halt.  He stated they were not prepared to hold property; they are strangling on their debt; and they have to unload and have a fire sale.  He stated they are hearing stories about people relinquishing their interest in properties with other partners because they cannot afford to carry them; but for those people who were prepared to carry them, they can do so, which  is why values are stagnant.  He stated those owners know that in three or four years from now the market is going to pull back up and the prices will go back up again; the Board heard a lot of evidence and testimony from the appraisers today; but he does not want the misperception that the Board is dealing with appraisals that are somehow significantly from a market value that was established by the purchase price of the landowners because he does not believe that to be the case.

 

Commissioner Colon stated she is glad Mr. Fountain brought that up because that has been some of the criticism; she has said these are willing sellers; people are saying government is trying to take advantage of the profits and the fact that land is going down and the owners cannot get rid of it; and a perfect example of that is that this started in 2003.  She stated it does not change all the questions she has asked today about getting a better appraisal; but it is important for the folks at home to know these are willing sellers and the County is not saying they must sell.  She stated the owners know exactly what they are doing; they want to sell the property to the County; and she is glad Mr. Fountain gave the example because that is the misconception of folks in the community who are thinking that the County has been trying to take advantage of what is going on in the market, but in some of these cases, they have been years in the making.                     

 

Mr. Fountain stated the County is successful with negotiating these contracts right now, not because values are backsliding, but because it is a normal real estate market; two to four years ago there was an expectation that one could list a big tract of land for sale and move it in thirty days making a substantial profit; and he is getting this from another appraiser that he is talking to in North Florida.  He stated today they have returned to the normal market; prices are not being suppressed or regressing; but the exposure time to sell, unless someone has to sell because they are financially in over their head, is back to the normal one to two years; and in a normal market the County’s process can compete.  He noted in the meteoric real estate market they went through for three years, the County could not compete.     

 

Chairman Scarborough thanked everyone for coming; and stated the discussion has been at the highest level. 

 

 

 

Chairman Scarborough advised the Board is moving into Executive Session; the persons attending the Attorney-Client Private Meeting will be himself, Commissioner Nelson, Commissioner Voltz, Commissioner Bolin, Commissioner Colon, County Manager Peggy Busacca, Deputy County Attorney Eden Bentley, and Angel Hampton of the Court Reporting Service; and the session will be one hour or less.  He stated after that the Board will take a short lunch break before moving into workshop session in the Florida Room.

 

Commissioner Voltz advised she will not be attending the workshop due to a prior commitment.   

 

The meeting recessed at 1:35 p.m. and reconvened at 2:35 p.m.

 

 

 

*Commissioner Voltz’s absence and *Deputy County Attorney Shannon Wilson presence were noted at this time.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Board will be talking this afternoon in the most general terms; Commissioner Bolin printed a list of the Board liaison assignments; and requested the Commissioners check the ones they want. 

 

Assistant County Manager Mel Scott stated this evening the City of West Melbourne is going to be considering a prospective annexation of 9.22 miles of the Platt property into the City limits; and suggested sending a letter advising the Board recognizes pursuit of the annexation, that it would include the alignment of the St. Johns Heritage Parkway perhaps moving into the City, and reinforcing the importance of the Board’s involvement in that parkway.  He stated it is also a proposed public facility that is in the County’s Comprehensive Plan, so it would then translate into the City’s Comprehensive Plan upon the annexation. 

 

Motion by Commissioner Bolin, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to direct staff to send a letter to the City of West Melbourne advising of the Board’s recognition of the pursuit of the annexation of 9.22 miles of the Platt property into the City limits and that the potential annexation includes the alignment of the St. Johns Heritage Parkway.  Motion carried and ordered unanimously.

 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated Ms. Busacca has been visiting with all the Commissioners; there are goods and bads of having a single Commissioner get involved with something; if a single Commissioner is authorized to champion a particular subject then that particular  Commissioner could bring together a workshop on the issue to share and drive the issue; and he would not want it to be if one Commissioner took the issue of crime or seniors that the rest of the Board could not worry about it because the one Commissioner was doing it.  He stated even though there would be one person putting together a workshop it would take the full commitment of the Board; with the space initiatives, if there were 12 Commissioners, they could not put enough effort into the things that need to occur in some areas; but he would like to know the areas that different Commissioners feel comfortable going and what they would like to champion; and he would like to know the things that the Board considers primary concerns for next year.

 

Commissioner Bolin stated she likes the idea of having an area of focus for a Commissioner because she does not have enough brain cells to cover all the topics in depth that need to be done; if there is a Commissioner who is going below the surface and delving into the issue of crime, she would be very comfortable having that Commissioner relay information to her; she would stay abreast of the issues in crime, but would have someone else doing the thorough in-depth research; and she likes that idea.  She stated there are many topics that the Board needs to work on; she is personally leaning toward the area of government efficiency; and because she worked for many years, before she was on the Board, with the municipalities, she has the advantage of all those years building up a rapport; when she worked as an employee of Emergency Management her job was Countywide; and she would like to do the coordination with the municipalities in the government efficiency area so they can partner on things.  She stated there are areas where the municipalities could help the County and vice versa; it would be mutual; and that is her vision of what she would like to do.

 

Commissioner Nelson stated he likes the concept; but he would like to continue to be involved in the space initiative although Commissioner Scarborough has taken the lead on that.  Chairman Scarborough stated he is afraid of having one Commissioner take too much of the lead; if he was the one to take the lead on that issue, there would be a problem since he is not going to be here next year and the problem is only going to get more difficult.  Chairman Scarborough stated on some things they will be able to have multiple Commissioners involved; and he would welcome Commissioner Nelson being involved on the space initiative issue.  Commissioner Nelson stated he would like to be involved; space is a major part of the District 2 makeup; and also part of that may relate to EDC kinds of activities as well because those are going to be inter-coordinated over the next few years.  He stated beyond that, growth has been a major concern; he does not mind sitting on the East Central Florida Regional Planning Council; and the only other one that interests him is the TDC because he has major hotels and hoteliers in his District. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he would like everybody to mark the sheet because there may be some people who want more than one issue; and it is okay to have more than one person serving on something. 

 

Commissioner Colon requested the Board discuss the issues one at a time because then it would be easier.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Commissioners can say anything they want; but the Board can go down the list if it wants.  He advised Ms. Busacca made up the list to help the Board; but it is the Board’s meeting; and it is not an agenda like a normal agenda. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated Commissioner Nelson wanted the issue of NASA restructuring; Commissioner Bolin wants government efficiency; and one of the things that was said was that even though a Commissioner might take something on, it does not stop the Commissioners from working on whatever they are working on.  She stated she has worked very closely with crime; she has been working closely with all the different chiefs throughout the County and also with the Sheriff; and it does not stop any other Commissioner from working very closely with whatever issue they have on their plate.  She stated she would like to be able to concentrate and continue; but the key think is to look at it in a holistic approach for the entire County versus just District 5.  She stated this is looking at the bigger picture instead of being all over the place; and the Chairman would like for each Commissioner to take on one of these issues and look at it on more of a Countywide basis, possibly bringing a workshop in the future. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Commissioner would take an issue, lead and chair a workshop, and set up all the people to speak; and he can recall in the past having these and they were excellent.  He stated many times there will be people coming in the same room who never came together before; for instance, with juvenile crime, they may end up with judges, law enforcement, and the school system; and all of a sudden they will be talking, so the Board will be the catalyst to start the conversation.  He stated such meetings can be excellent for the whole community; that would be his hope; and requested the Commissioners put down their names that they will be bringing together a workshop and sharing. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated that would be wonderful; it is exciting for her because she has been working with different municipalities individually; and she has wanted to bring in the Sheriff’s Department.  She advised the Sheriff’s Department already meets with the different police chiefs; but she would like to have this kind of workshop so the community at large would be able to see the meetings that have been taking place and get a sense of how closely the agencies are working in a holistic approach.  She stated it would not stop any Commissioner from working closely with whatever they are working on within their district, but it would entail everyone, so if it is all right with Chairman Scarborough, she would like to head the crime issue.  Chairman Scarborough stated there is juvenile justice as well as crime; and inquired if Commissioner Colon should be put down for both or is it a separate issue.  Commissioner Colon responded they work together so she will head crime and juvenile justice.  She stated for years now she has been putting together a lot of youth summits in regard to crime and bringing speakers from out of state to talk to law enforcement, pastors, and the community in regard to how important it is to focus because that is where the issue stems from.  She stated the second that young people get in trouble, it stems to everything else. 

 

Chairman  Scarborough stated Ms. Busacca put the list together, but it does not limit the Board’s discussion; and he was advised by a professor from UCF that the County is heading for the perfect storm.  He stated there is the construction industry downturn; there are houses on the market already; the Clerk of Courts has advised of foreclosures; there are interest rate increases; inflation is increasing; gas prices are increasing; inflation restricts the ability of a retiree to go out to dinner or do more; higher gas prices will mean less tourists; and there are all these multiple effects.  He stated the Board needs to get a handle on the overall complexity of the economic environment in which it exits; and the Board could bring in someone from the construction industry, someone from the tourist industry, and someone who could speak to the complexities of how these things can affect other components of the economy.  He stated someone mentioned if certain events happen in Washington, D.C., there could be a decrease in defense spending, which would impact the industry in South Brevard, which is key to defense; and inquired what is the range of what is predicted, what would it mean if it occurred, and what can the Board do if it sees all these things coming together.     

 

Commissioner Colon inquired at what point would it behoove the Board to make sure the Commissioners are connected to the committees accordingly; and would she focus on something that has to do with Children’s Services and the Judicial Conflict Committee, for example.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated it could be consistent; and it may actually be better to have people choose things that are not exactly the same.  He stated maybe everything does not have to line up completely; but if a Commissioner is already doing a lot of work, they do not want redundancy.  He stated if there are more than five issues, the Commissioners may have to take different issues and go in a totally different direction; and he does not think it is bad for a Commissioner to look at different issues.

 

Commissioner Bolin stated if the Commissioners are taking what they have as their specialty and looking at committees, she would like to be involved in the Internal Audit Committee because that is flowing with what she was looking at; and she was also looking at the EDC because of reaching out to the business community to assist in government efficiency.  She stated she can see where the EDC has many who would like to be involved.  Chairman Scarborough stated the Board is putting $1.6 million into the EDC today; there are two members on the East Central Florida Regional Planning Committee (ECFRPC); the EDC is more critical than the ECFRPC; and the Board can ask to have more than one member, if it would be beneficial. 

 

Commissioner Bolin commented on the Growth Management Coalition meeting that she and Commissioner Nelson attended; and stated that caused a problem.  She stated they were trying to work through issues, but could not voice their opinions because they were both at the same
meeting.  Chairman Scarborough requested Ms. Wilson look into where the Commissioners can and cannot attend and provide a legal opinion on where the Board is restricted.  He advised with the MPO there are all five Commissioners; and with the ECFRPC there are two attendees.  Ms. Wilson stated normally the County Attorney would recommend that it be handled when it is something less than another statutory committee like the MPO by advertising it as a Board of County Commissioners meeting as well as the other that is also under the Sunshine Law, and they be done jointly; but she will look at that in a more broad perspective as well.

 

Commissioner Colon stated at the meetings with the Growth Management Coalition it was important to have two Commissioners because of the fact that the majority of the cities were being represented; that was one of the things they focused on as far as making sure they were complying with the law by advertising those meetings; they are open for public comments and so forth; and although no one attends, the meetings are definitely open. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated some of the topics that were talked about were going to come before the Board.  Commissioner Nelson stated he agrees; what was unclear was how it was enabled in the first place and whether it was advertised according to the Sunshine Law and those factors; and that is where they got very uncomfortable.  He stated he realizes in a Sunshine setting, they can talk about those issues again being cautious; they cannot say, for instance, how they are going to vote and those kinds of things; but they can still discuss the issues.  He stated his discomfort was that they were not sure whether this was a committee outside the Sunshine Law, which would then place them at risk as opposed to a committee that was covered by the Sunshine Law.  Chairman Scarborough stated the Board can get an opinion back from the attorney and find out. 

 

Commissioner Nelson inquired how was that group created; with County Manager Peggy Busacca responding it was a League of Cities request; she does not know if the Board put together a Resolution; but she will see if she can get some history on the group.  Chairman Scarborough stated the question becomes if something is very important, is it such that the Board has to restrict itself to just one Commissioner; and if something is coming before the EDC, why should the Board say Commissioner Colon cannot go.  He stated he does not know if that has to be the case, but they will find out. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated the EDC has subcommittees; and inquired can there be a Commissioner who represents the Board on the EDC Board, but then another Commissioner can go to the subcommittee.  Chairman Scarborough stated to his knowledge, the Commissioners have not been involved in the subcommittee activity; when he attended some years back, he would basically go to the meetings; it is huge meeting; and it is not like there is a lot of discussion because there is a PowerPoint presentation.  He stated the risk of getting into major decisions and discussion on decisions is minimal in an environment like that; the ECFRPC discussions are going to occur but many times they come right back to the Board; but they can get a legal opinion. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated with the EDC it really has to be one appointee because there are meetings for the Executive Board that are behind closed doors; at that point, they would definitely want one appointee; and there is nothing that stops any Commissioner from being part of the subcommittees.  Chairman Scarborough stated Commissioner Colon is probably right because with two attendees, they could run into problems.  Commissioner Colon stated that is not in the Sunshine; and it is totally different than the Growth Management group where it is recorded, has minutes, and allows public comments.  Commissioner Colon stated there is nothing wrong with discussing anything that is in the Sunshine, but as far as the one behind closed doors, they do not even want to go there at all; and they will avoid that, but going to the subcommittees is an excellent idea.     

 

Commissioner Bolin inquired how about the East Central Florida Regional Planning Committee meetings because they are noticed meetings, but she does not know if she has ever seen it being recorded.  Commissioner Colon stated it is recorded; they take attendance; and the minutes are being taken.  Commissioner Bolin stated she guesses she was looking for cameras.  Commissioner Colon advised the ECFRPC is totally governed by the Sunshine Law. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated just because something is not listed does not mean the Board cannot go there; it has already talked about economics; but if there is something else that should be on the list, the Board can look at it and if there are things that the Board does not need to send someone to, that is okay. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated that is an excellent point; what she tried to do last time was feel for what the Commissioners’ interests were; for instance, the environment was important to Commissioner Nelson; and each Commissioner could recommend to Chairman Scarborough one committee where a Commissioner does not need to be there so they can focus more on others. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Board needs to distinguish between those things where the Board will have someone attend because someone wants to attend and those where a Commissioner is going to champion a cause and bring forth a group in the community to find new ways of doing business.  He stated he would hope that everybody would at least take one issue where they would champion a cause and chair a workshop; and it is not just the Board discussion but the public discussion that is good.  He stated the whole community watches the workshops; they begin talking about the ideas and how things have to be addressed; so the Board has a responsibility not just to do things, but to mirror ideas.  He stated mirroring ideas makes everything happen; if there is not an opportunity to step back far enough to get people to think, it is tragic; and commented on attending meetings and more complex issues being beaten down by dealing with other issues. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated for some there are probably Ordinances requiring there to be a Commissioner like the MPO, Value Adjustment Board, the East Central Florida Regional Planning Council, the Canvassing Board, and the TDC; but some of the other ones are just the result of a group coming to the Board and asking to have a Commissioner sit on their committee; and the next thing a Commissioner is sitting at meetings year after year.  She stated it would behoove the Board to find out exactly which ones are required by Ordinance.

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired if Ms. Busacca can provide a list; with Ms. Busacca responding absolutely. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated she was on the Children’s Services Council this year, but it only met two or three times; and it is a required one.  Ms. Busacca advised the Board can choose to amend that if it has evolved beyond that.  Commissioner Colon stated some may be a contract with the State where the State requires an elected official; and that is the information the Board wants to find out.  Commissioner Bolin inquired what is Together in Partnership; with Commissioner Colon responding the Board has been pretty active in TIP.  Commissioner Colon advised it is all the agencies coming together to focus on children’s issues.  Ms. Wilson stated the group better coordinates children’s issue; but it is not a State law, and is a County thing.  Commissioner Colon stated the Children’s Services Council is probably from the State.

 

Chairman Scarborough requested the Commissioners think of a place where the Board is not represented, that may be uncomfortable to go there, but if it does not go there, it will be failing the community.  He stated it is not only what the Commissioners champion, but places it needs to go where it has not been represented before that are important; and requested Commissioners step up to the plate.  He stated sometimes it is better to try and fail than to just keep going where one is comfortable; it is okay if they put forth a good effort; and maybe just by bringing it up, the Board will address the problem in a better way later.  He stated there may be problems that the Commissioners have run into in their offices where the Board is not doing what it could or should.

 

Commissioner Colon stated when they had the symposium or summit for the space initiative, there were many folks who sent letters to her office saying if they had more notice they would have been there; and these were elected officials from outside of Brevard County.  She suggested having another summit in January with the Chairman giving plenty of notice and inviting Congressmen and State Representatives; and stated they would have to have Legislative Coordinator Leigh Holt help to see when the Legislators are not in Washington or Tallahassee.  She stated her office tried to send notice to some of the folks; some letters have been received advising the Board can count on support; but because of the short notice, people were not able to be there.  She stated she learned there is support outside of the County besides those in Central Florida; and with plenty of notice, there would be more folks coming, which is what is needed, to have champions from all over the State. 

 

Commissioner Bolin inquired if the Florida Association of Counties (FAC) has ever had a workshop presented to it on space; with Chairman Scarborough responding that is a good question.  Commissioner Colon stated the Board could see if the FAC would be interested in allowing Brevard County to have something at the meeting next summer; they would need more champions outside of the area; and suggested asking the other Commissioners from Central Florida to echo that request.  Commissioner Bolin stated they should seek out the other people are elected officials who attend this to see if they have champions of different area like they are doing for the vision for next year; and if they do that too, the Board might find someone who is has a champion on crime so she could tell Commissioner Colon that she met someone and this is what they are doing in their county.  She stated they could try to coordinate more people because she found getting information from other counties has been very good and informative; and they cannot work in a vacuum.

 

Ms. Busacca advised on November 27, 2007 the Board will have a draft of its legislative package; she expects the Board to adopt space as one of the priorities; and it may be very good for each Commissioner to call the Commission Chairman of a couple of other counties and advise the Board is very interested in, request they look at the County’s legislative package to see if they can ask their Legislative Delegation to support it.  She stated she intends to do that with County Managers; she will find places like West Palm Beach that has a large impact and focus on them first; but each of them should speak to their equivalents throughout the State because there is still time for them to get support from their Legislative Delegations as well.

Chairman Scarborough advised of attending a health care workshop in Orlando with Human Resources Director Frank Abbate; and stated they got into the issues of malpractice, insurance, and multiple issues, which he found fascinating.  He stated sometimes at the Florida Association of Counties meetings, they sit at such a high superficial level that they cannot really see; and sometimes a Commission needs to drop down to see.  He stated there are a tremendous number of national conferences that are held an hour’s drive from Brevard County that staff is attending; it is a minimal amount to attend; and suggested Commissioners take a day to go over and they will be immersed into health care, or insurance issues, or all the other issues.  He stated the thing is reaching beyond where one feels comfortable and going to different groups; there were some things he learned about health care that would scare one to death as far as employer paid health care in the State of Florida; Florida is at the bottom; and the worst area is around Disney World because there are people who are not taken care of which impacts the hospitals and the health care.  He stated in Brevard County they have the Harris Corporation or the Space Center so they have a different environment, but it is very near; and the questions are what that means for the type of health care that is provided as people get elderly, and what does health care mean.  He stated they are not going to hear those issues at the Florida Association of Counties; they need to go out because some of these things are available; and they can come back and advise this is an element that the Board needs to be cognizant of.  He stated through the year the Board will hear things; Jerry Visco will talk about all the problems with health care; but it is much more profound than the Board understands and some of the issues are going to creep up on the County and the community.  He stated the Commissioners are free to go, do, and come back to challenge the remaining Commissioners.

 

Commissioner Colon stated that is an excellent point; it can be done under Reports; she was just in one last week where there was talk with long-term providers, hospice, and so forth; and she was asked to come and speak, but she learned a lot.  She advised she learned that when it comes to Alzheimer’s, there is now a patch that is even more effective than the drug; she was intrigued and excited by that; and she wished everybody in the community knew of it.  She stated that is really where the Chairman is giving direction that if Commissioners are attending any of these things and there is something that stands out, they can invite someone to come speak under Reports about something the community needs to hear about; and therefore the information will get out to the public.  She stated it is going to be a very productive year under Chairman Scarborough’s leadership because it is getting the Board to look at the bigger picture.

 

Commissioner Bolin stated for years now she has been going to League of Cities meetings as an individual; she would like to continue with that; and she would also like to approach the League of Cities to see if it would consider allowing a Commissioner to attend the board meetings of the League of Cities and become involved with it that way.  She stated that might be a good liaison for the Board to do. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated she does not know if it is appropriate to ask the League of Cities; but it is upsetting to go to the meetings.  She stated they do not go to socialize; they are there to learn what the cities are doing; there have been some issues in regard to the finance part with the League of Cities feeling the Commissioners are just there for a free meal; and she has eaten enough rubber chickens that she really does not need another one.  She stated it is offensive when they are being questioned about whether, as elected officials, they should be at a League of Cities event; and she just wanted to bring it to the Board’s attention.  She stated they would not be there if they were not elected officials trying to learn what is going on in the cities; it is taking time from their schedules to go to such events; and then it is a question of the $20 or whatever the amount is. 

 

Ms. Busacca stated she has a suggestion; in the past the Board has made a formal motion that such events are to be approved; and there is a policy that Finance has to say this is the Board action.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated the Board may want to have one motion that covers a lot of this stuff because it is a lot easier on the Clerk’s Office if the Board approves certain things; they can have a blanket-type thing; and he is encouraging people to go out, learn, and bring back ideas.  Ms. Busacca stated staff will put something together and put it on the Agenda, so the Board can formally approve it, and that will be easier for the Clerk’s Office.  Chairman Scarborough stated that is good; with Ms. Busacca advising she will do it.

 

Commissioner Colon stated each Commissioner needs to give the feedback of what they have been attending. 

 

Chairman Colon stated they should make the approval fairly broad because sometimes there are things that have not been contemplated, such as travel to Tallahassee for lobbying efforts; someone may need to go to Tallahassee tomorrow and they are caught in a quagmire because they do not have Board approval; and they could have blanket approval of some things like that.   

 

Commissioner Bolin stated Chairman Scarborough said he would like to work on space, but he has not voiced what area he is going to be looking at. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he is interested in the multiple economic effects; he met with a professor when he was at Florida TODAY and he was talking about the perfect storm where there would be space, construction, gas taxes hitting the tourist industry, inflation hitting the retirees, and maybe reductions in defense spending; and the question is how are they going to talk about that and who would bring it in to talk about multiple issues.  He stated everything plays in its own environment; what happened with the Challenger may be different than what happened with the Apollo Program; in the Apollo Program, for instance, they had the youngest population in the State; but many of the people who work in the space industry today are much older.  He stated the Board needs to do the best it can to understand the complexities of the problems that may be bringing different people in; and he would like to play with that idea to see if it matures because he thinks there is something more than just space.  He stated multiple issues are coming into play; but tonight he may think of something different; and that is what he wants the other Commissioners to do.  He stated any time a Commissioner thinks of something different, they can go off and explore that idea; and if the Board is open to ideas, it is going to be in a much better posture.  He stated one of the things that everybody seems to agree on throughout the country and the world is that things are going to change profoundly, although no one really knows how; they hear the Chinese are controlling America’s currency more than the Federal Reserve; the Social Security system that more and more people in Florida are going to rely on is going to be in jeopardy; and the Board having an informed conversation will help it through the multiple problems. 

 

Ms. Busacca requested Chairman Scarborough share with the Board the turkey example.  Chairman Scarborough stated he told Ms. Busacca about a book called The Black Swan; the theory is it is the event that one does not anticipate is the most dangerous; and the gentleman uses the example of the turkey who has a kind person who comes in to feed him, but one day when the kind person comes to feed him, he has an axe.  He stated the turkey does not anticipate that because it is an event that is totally different; the question is what one can anticipate; and the Board may want to talk about dealing with multiple complex factors as it identifies where it needs to go and what it needs to do.  Chairman Scarborough noted that is just one example, but the idea is the Commissioners are exposed to more ideas than 99 percent of Brevard County because people are calling on all these different issues; and the Commissioners have the ability to say they will ignore this issue but look at another.  

 

Commissioner Colon stated everything they have been discussing ties together; she has gone to Orange County frequently for meetings; and things she has seen personally are probably the reason she is taking on crime.  She stated there is the beautiful community of Orlando and Orange County; it spent monies to bring companies to Central Florida; the investment of the taxpayer dollars went into doing all of that; but there was a component that was neglected, which was making sure that they had the right type of law enforcement.  She stated they did not see that coming; but now it is a number one issue.  She stated it affects it one way or another; if the Board wants to protect the investment of the taxpayer, it has to make sure that there is another angle in regard to all of that; and if it wants to protect, then it will want to make sure that it protects the workforce that comes to Kennedy Space Center, so it all ties together.  She stated crime, growth management, and everything the Board is discussing ties together; there is not one issue they can say is the priority; and inquired what will happen if they focus on all on space but neglect crime or neglect the seniors.  She stated they cannot be a single issue Commission; and she would like to give Ms. Busacca a month when she would want to have a workshop ready to go.  She stated one of the things that has happened in the past is that the Board has gotten all excited about something, but then did not discuss it; one time there was a suggestion to bring back a book report; she was excited about it; but then she did not dare bring up a book that she wanted to share.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if Commissioner Colon wants to do that; with Commissioner Colon responding no, it was just an example where the Board did not follow through.  Commissioner Colon stated she loved the idea thought because there were some books that she wanted to share with the Board.  Chairman Scarborough stated the thing is they are able to take something that is to some extent very abstract and bring it back to Brevard County; and it is not just knowing the book but applying it and seeing how it can be applied in Brevard County.  He inquired if that would be okay; with Commissioner Bolin responding I t is great.  Chairman Scarborough stated he will lead off with some; he will do a selection; and The Black Swan, The Tipping Point, and Non-lineal Chaos may be among them.  He stated the reports would be five minutes at the most; but the idea would be that from there, the Board can begin to look at things in the whole process differently.  He stated the problem is they are not in school anymore; and commented on the differences between learning something in school and learning as a County Commissioner.  He stated it is what is not on the list; it is what somebody is not thinking about, but then wakes up in the middle of the night and realizes the Board is not talking about this issue; that is the difference between being in school and being a Commissioner; and he thinks the community is mature enough to understand. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated it was good when the Board had the workshop during the budget season and had the EDC present; the community was excited to see all the partnerships; and it was brought together because of that workshop.  She stated it showed the community how Dr. DiPatri was on top of the science and math to make sure there would be future engineers and how he is working closely with BCC, UCF, and FIT; and it was the only time the community was able to hear that they are working on that.  She stated folks are retiring; and when that workforce retires, Brevard County is ready to fill that gap.  She stated that goes along with what the Board was talking about in terms of communicating to the citizens and how it affects everything that each agency does.  She stated that problem is huge; the Commissioners are not
the School Board and cannot fix it; but the School Board, because it is part of the EDC, Lead Brevard, and other organizations, is working together; and people would be surprised at what is being done.  Commissioner Colon stated they think Orlando and Orange County are ahead of Brevard County, but that is wrong; and Brevard County is always ahead of what the other communities are doing, which makes her proud when she goes outside the County.  She stated she tries to come back with ideas from any meetings she attends; and if feels good because she realizes how well the Board communicates with the business community, with academia, with space, and everything.  She stated the Board should be proud of that; she does not think the Board gives itself enough credit; but they are able to see that when they go outside the County.  She stated she is asked how the Commissioners get along with the Sheriff and answers that Brevard County’s Sheriff is awesome; in other areas elected officials are not getting along well with their law enforcement; and she cannot fathom that because law enforcement and elected officials have to work very closely together to give the tools needed to protect the community.  She stated the County is doing okay; it can absolutely do better; but it is a good feeling when the County knows that it is being progressive. 

 

Chairman Scarborough inquired which workshop Commissioner Colon wants to chair; with Commissioner Colon responding she will chair the workshop on crime.  Chairman Scarborough stated if they go ahead and do that, they can get started; and inquired which workshop Commissioner Nelson would like to chair.  He inquired if Commissioner Nelson would like to do the next space workshop; with Commissioner Nelson responding with Chairman Scarborough’s help.  Chairman Scarborough stated he will help.  Commissioner Bolin stated she will do the government efficiency workshop.  Commissioner Colon suggested Commissioner Bolin work with the other municipalities too.  Commissioner Bolin stated she will work with the municipalities; and also she wants the individuals who are leaders in the community and industry.  She stated there are a lot of high-tech companies in the County; the companies are running very well; and the County needs to learn about some of the systems and how it can implement the same policies to help the County do things efficiently too.  She stated she wants to bring consensus of a lot of individuals and companies to assist the County; Brevard County government is transparent; and she needs to be able to have the leaders in industry see how transparent government is and welcome them to give input. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated that is an important part; and commented on a letter to the editor suggesting the County get rid of ten percent of its trucks.  He stated the public does not see vehicles as tools to get work done; and the Board probably does not do a very good job of explaining why they cannot have all the inspectors in one vehicle because they will lose productivity.  He stated they do a better job than they get credit for because they do not take credit; they do not say the kinds of things they do; and it would add some value if they shared that with the business community.  He stated they could look at it and say there are things the County is doing right, but there may be other things it could do better; and he does not think County government is as bad as it is sometimes portrayed. 

 

Commissioner Bolin stated what she feels strongly about is that the County has a wealth of brain power in major industry, non-profits, and for-profits that it is not tapping into; and what she would like to do in the next year is bring them in and get some input from them. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated she would like the Board to give direction to Ms. Busacca concerning public relations; she talked to Ms. Busacca about this in the past and who was going to be doing it; but the Board needs to make sure that every couple of weeks whoever Ms. Busacca assigns to do public relations gets the word out in regard to a Department or one of the agencies and what it is working on.  Commissioner Colon stated it could be a project or how taxpayers’ dollars are being used or a service that is being provided; but they need to do a better job of sharing with the community the things that are being done.  She stated they will have to make sure the writer is going to write a balanced article; there are some cities that have hired someone just for public relations; and she has seen articles on a regular basis about what that community is doing, whether it is economic development or roads that are being built.  She stated the municipality is letting the citizens know how their taxpayer dollars are being used; and the County needs to do a better job.  She stated she would not mind starting with this particular issue, advising how the job gets done and why the trucks are needed; and that is just an example.  She inquired if Ms. Busacca has suggestions.  Ms. Busacca stated Kimberly Prosser is talented, not only in her role with Space Coast Government Television, but also in this role; she could do as other communities do in putting out a certain number of positive stories; and it would not just be announcements but a more in-depth work with each Department to talk about what they have recently accomplished.  She stated the Board just did the boating study; that can be put together and packaged by Ms. Prosser with help from the Department; and that will make the information available, people will have a resource if they want to use it, and it will show people what they are getting for their dollars.                      

 

Chairman Scarborough stated good things happen and nobody says they have happened; and that is sad because it is not only good for the public but for those people who are doing good internally and should be recognized for the good things that are happening.  He stated many times the Board misses the opportunity to let people know that there are some very good talented people working for the County. 

       

Commissioner Nelson stated it was interesting today as the awards were given to the folks who participated in the Citizens Academy he heard comments about the dedicated employees; some referenced having been in other locations where it was not quite that way; and Brevard County does have some very good employees and the more exposure that is given to them in that kind of setting, the more people will understand that they are doing a good job.

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he would like to know how much time each Commissioner will need to prepare for their workshop so they can start scheduling them as quickly as possible.  Commissioner Colon stated she would like to do her first one at the end of February.  Chairman Scarborough inquired if Commissioner Nelson wants to let them know later; with Commissioner Nelson responding yes.  Commissioner Nelson stated the Board has talked about a variety of topics on space; he does not want to be redundant; and just as there is a new generation space vehicle, maybe there should be a next generation workshop.  Chairman Scarborough stated there is risk out there as well; and recommended Commissioner Nelson meet with Marsh Heard, Frank DiBello, and Lee Solid as well as Bob Walker from Washington, D.C.; and advised of an event to be held in Boulder, Colorado.  He stated he was told if someone wants to get the global dimension of seeing the Chinese and the Russians, they will never get it without going to Boulder; and encouraged Commissioners to go to Boulder, Colorado.  He stated the U.S. used to control, but it does not control the number of launches here; and they need to know where the other people are going and what the competition is. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated what they are doing at the workshop is not solving the problems of the world; they are bringing in experts to be able to start the dialogue; and that is why she is very comfortable bringing something back in February.  She stated the is not expecting to solve all the problems of Brevard in one workshop; she is just planning to bring all the players together to communicate to the Board some of the things that it can be doing; and that is very easy to do.  Chairman Scarborough stated first there is awareness; and the awareness itself is the most powerful tool because then the Board will begin to think.  He stated the Board had some excellent workshops in the past on things like juvenile crime and those issues; everybody who participated said it was the first time they saw all the different players talking; and the Board is able to call these meetings.  Commissioner Bolin advised she is energized.  Chairman Scarborough requested everybody give him their list when they get a change; and stated they will see where they are going with that.  He inquired if Ms. Busacca has any other thoughts.  Ms. Busacca stated staff is excited about this; she has talked to most of the Directors about it; they know that as the Board is doing new things they will be expected to step up and do new things as well; and requested the Board let her know how they can do things differently.  Chairman Scarborough stated he hopes if staff has any ideas in terms of where the Board needs to go in treading new ground, they will speak up; and commented on meetings with staff leading to finding out where opportunities exist.  He stated the question for staff is what the Board should be doing and what it can do differently for a better County.  Ms. Busacca stated staff is watching today; they knew this was going to be a different kind of workshop; and the Board will probably hear more than it wants to hear.  Chairman Scarborough stated they are an open Commission and appreciate people’s frank comments. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated it would behoove the Board to ask Ms. Busacca, knowing what is coming down the pipeline, if it is possible to identify some of the discussions in regards to the referendum on January 29, 2008.  She stated Chairman Scarborough attended a meeting where some things came up that were eye opening; and inquired if they are able to touch on that a little bit or is staff doing more research. 

 

Chairman Scarborough stated he appeared at a Florida TODAY event with Stockton Whitten and other staff members; and advised even among the experts, there is not a clear understanding of the impact of the referendum.  He stated people need to know that although the County reduced its revenues, 30 percent of the persons with Save Our Homes had higher taxes because of the three percent that goes up to assess from taxable value; there are methodologies when they run all those things that there could be roll forward under the TRIM, which is the millage; and if they double the homestead, they are supposed to get less in taxes, but even the doubling of the homestead kicks in the roll forward.  He stated everybody says it is simple; during the summer the Board thought as it was reducing the revenue that everybody was going to have less taxes, but it is not that simple; and it is probably going to be at the end of next summer when people get their tax bills that they will be able to look at it and say they did it in the global picture, but within the County, they learned that there are 40 different scenarios with the different taxing districts.  He stated he is not talking about the cities or the Florida Inland Navigation District; but they can put together 40 different combinations because different ones overlap.  He stated people say it is simpler, but it is extremely complex; and commented on talking at the global level, reducing what the County spends, individuals with Save Our Homes most likely having higher taxes, and the way TRIM was passed in 1980 requires the Tax Collector to collect taxes.   

 

Ms. Busacca stated she has nothing to add except to say that staff will do its best to figure out what it understands and discuss it with each Commissioner individually; it is fairly confusing; and then the Board will have to decide exactly what information it wants to provide to the public. 

 

Commissioner Colon stated that is where she has a problem; the Board is not putting this on a referendum; the people who have voted to put it on the referendum are the ones who owe it to the citizens to explain what they are about to do to them; and that is where it was uncomfortable the last time because the questions were being directed to their offices.  Commissioner Colon stated she kept saying that the Commissioners were not the ones putting this on the ballot, and therefore people needed to ask the folks who did put it on the ballot.  She stated it is important that once they have a little feeling of what they are talking about to invite the Delegation; and they can ask if the Legislators realize what they are about to do to the citizens because she does not think they realize that.  She stated she thought it was very simple; she thought raising the homestead was positive; but then she realized that 21 percent are going to be hurt even more and the business community is also going to be affected.  She stated this is not what she expected; she thought Tallahassee was going to try to help the citizens; so as soon as they can figure things out, the Delegation needs to be informed because she does not want anyone to say the Board new about it and played ignorant.  She stated the Legislators voted for it; they need to know what they just told the citizens to do; the voters trust the Legislators as the elected officials who put it on the referendum; and it is their job to have a workshop with the community to explain to the citizens.  She stated what the Board has found is that it will hurt a certain percentage of the citizens, which she does not think is what the Legislature set out to do; but unfortunately it looks like there are some ramifications based on what is about to happen on January 29, 2008.  She stated they need to explain to the community; and Tallahassee put it on the ballot, not the Board of County Commissioners. 

 

Commissioner Nelson stated there are dangers in letting the Legislature say what the impacts are; and the Board is going to have to do some of it.  Chairman Scarborough stated they made it very simple, but the truth of the matter is that it is not simple; and he got into a lot of data, but it was so much data that people could not even pick up on it.  Commissioner Nelson stated the conclusion that a lot of people drew was that the Legislature does not necessarily understand it; Commissioner Scarborough was asked if he could not reduce his $1.2 billion budget by two percent; but the County does not have a $1.2 billion budget, which Chairman Scarborough had explained previously; but it was still out there and that is still distressing because one can read into that whatever one wants.  He stated either they do not understand or they are intentionally not using the information correctly, but either way it is wrong and troubling; and he saw the same thing in Tallahassee.  Chairman Scarborough stated they begin to take enterprise funds out; half of the General Revenue budget goes to the Charter Officers; then they double count with fund accounting; and they get to the bottom line and have a few things they can do.  He stated they tried to do it in a rational method to have non-reoccurring pay for reoccurring and to keep long-term objectives in mind as well as doing the jail and the courthouse; they are talking the simple thing; but they do a disservice if they do not put things because the County had much discussion at such depth while the Legislature did not.  He stated the leadership of the Legislature got together and cut a deal; and the Board sat here week after week talking about hundred thousand dollar cuts that were significant to certain people.  Commissioner Nelson stated it has been frustrating; he heard some testimony this morning about wanting the fire assessment to go away and see ad valorem; and probably the Board is agreeable and would like to go in that direction.  He stated the Board cannot change because of what the Legislature has created; however, it is still being treated like it has control over that, which is frustrating.  Chairman Scarborough stated this is probably going to be a frustrating year.  Commissioner Nelson stated his workshop will definitely be after January 29, 2008.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Upon motion and vote, the meeting was adjourned at 3:47 p.m.

 

 

                                                                        _____________________________________

                                                                        TRUMAN SCARBOROUGH, CHAIRMAN

                                                                        BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS

ATTEST:                                                         BREVARD COUNTY, FLORIDA

 

 

 

_____________________

SCOTT ELLIS, CLERK

   

          (S E A L)